TCLA Vacation Scheme Applications Discussion Thread 2024-25

[Ram Sabaratnam]

Hi guys!
For DWF, they ask:
Please complete the personal statement below in no more than 750 words. Please note that you will be scored on your drafting ability as well as your content. Within your personal statement please answer the following questions:

• What are your motivations for wanting to pursue a career as a Solicitor at DWF? (250 words)
• The DWF value 'Be Better Together' is key to our business. Please identify when you have demonstrated this value and how you would apply this to the role of a Trainee Solicitor. (250 words)
• Please comment on a commercial news topic or trend which has interested you recently. Within your response, please consider how this news topic or trend is relevant to DWF. (250 words)

I've answered all three as individual questions. Do you think I need to make a link between all of them to make it more one document, or is having a separation fine?

Thank you!

Howdy @AlegalA

I'm pretty much in agreement with what @Jessica Booker said. If you really want to, there's no harm in trying to ensure there's some flow or continuity between the separate paragraphs. You could, for instance, add small, connecting sentences between the sections. For example, in the ‘Be Better Together’ section, you can mention how DWF's collaborative culture is something you'd be well-suited to and then discuss your particular example for that section. These short transitional sentences can give your statement a cohesive feel, but again it's not entirely necessary.

Best of luck!

 

[Tintin06]

Based on vibes, which of your applications do you think stands the best chance? For me, it's Arnold & Porter!

 

[Gday33]

Jones Day PFO 😔

 

[Tcvspfo]

Based on vibes, which of your applications do you think stands the best chance? For me, it's Arnold & Porter!

Gibson Dunn am jk btw just bringing some entertainment cheer up everyone we all will get there soon.

 

[sammm10101]

Jones Day PFO 😔

Aaaa im sorry, if you don’t mind me asking which scheme was your application for? also what stage of the process was it?

 

[l789]

I think there is a limit as to how much you can prepare for the WG - both because of the structure of the test itself and because of the limited availability of resources. There is also definitely a point of diminishing returns, as the time you invest in WG preparation can also be used for researching/writing for new applications, attending firm events, improving commercial awareness etc. As such, my view is that a few days to a week of concentrated preparation and practice is generally more than sufficient for ensuring that you have done everything you can be reasonably expected to so as be in the best possible place to get a high score.

Thank you Andrei for such a detailed and thoughtful response.

I think you’re right, I’m going to stop procrastinating and get it over and out the way, your transparency is very helpful!

 

[Bread]

I completely agree with @IneedaTCASAP's great response. Having gotten TC offers from a number of firms with low VS conversation rates, I observed that most of the very visible people, who would always make it a point to be seen and to try to impress those around them, tended not to get offers. However, many of the 'quieter' and slightly more relaxed people ended up getting offers.

Of course, this is not to say that you should not try to be as hard working, focused, and enthusiastic as possible in the circumstances. Those are positive aspects that will be counted in your favor. However, you need to read the rooms your are in. First of all, as a vacation schemer just because of your lack of experience you will necessarily be at the bottom of the competence hierarchy within the firm. While contributions and creative thinking are evidently valued, it is quite unlikely you will blow people away with your knowledge and skills. Thus, you should simply focus on doing a good job and scoring well in all the criteria you are expected to score well. Pay particular attention to the time you are supposed to complete an assignment by, at the structure and clarity of your drafting, and at spelling, grammar and punctuation. You would be surprised how many students who focus on making 'brilliant' substantive points overlook those.

Secondly, this applies in the social interaction context as well. It is essential that you form a good relationship with your supervisor and other team members. In most cases I have observed, the key to that is just to be flexible around the lawyers' attitude. If you see that they are particularly interested in discussing their work with you, be engaged and ask many questions about that. If they seem stressed and want to focus on their work, do not interrupt them many times to try to force a conversation. If you see they are more interested in spending the limited free time they have to just relax and discuss something unrelated to work, do not insist on such topics. If the dynamic allows you to ask them about their personal life and interests and thus develop a more informal relationship, you should definitely try to do that.

Thank you, this is very helpful!

 

[RonRod13]

At what point is multiple VSs an issue? If you've done a few, does it suggest you're not worth giving one too in case you won't convert it? I'm just frustrated because I graduated five years, took a break to do a masters in an unrelated field because I was convinced after the Travers Smith VS in 2020 that I had no chance in the law. That was an expensive sulk. However, in the last cycle I got three ACs and one VS. I'm only interested in US firms. GCSEs: ABBBBCCC, A-Levels: AAA. Degree: 62.5% (2.1). I have mitigating circumstances. I did work experience at Slaughter and May in 2018 and VSs at Debevoise, Travers Smith and Ropes & Gray. I don't understand why I'm getting rejected for everything so far in this cycle. About six rejections so far. I so think open days help you jump the queue somewhat, however I've just got onto one competitive one so far. I'm 27 now.

I don’t think having multiple vac schemes is the issue. If you got one last cycle, u can probs do it again this cycle. I’ve noticed you apply for a ridiculously high number of firms, I think you should focus on getting to the final round in at least 25%- 33% of your applications, then you’ll get more vac schemes and it’ll be easier to convert.

You’re in a position which many candidates can’t even relate with because just getting one vac scheme or one final round at all in these economic conditions is an incredible challenge. Some people struggle with online tests, some with video interviews, some with ACs. Yours seems to be with the vac scheme conversion which is painful because you’re so close to the offer, trust me I understand. It’s just a numbers game. 5 vac schemes is the new 1 vac scheme. 10 final rounds is the new 2 final rounds. We’re all suffering. The London job market is a jungle and everyone wants to eat but can’t get fed…

If you’re really dead set on US firms you can always apply regionally, and I would strongly consider this given that it’s only going to get harder and harder year on year and you’re not getting any younger. You’ll probably only need to do under 5 apps to secure the TC. Focus on becoming the best lawyer you can within a specialist area throughout the two years of QWE. And hopefully, if the market is booming again, you’ll get that highly sought after NQ salary (which is the real reason why anyone wants a US firm let’s be real).

 

[Deleted member 37508]

Based on vibes, which of your applications do you think stands the best chance? For me, it's Arnold & Porter!

Dechert I hope.

 

[Amehta1]

What decides when people hear back from an AC? I had people in my AC that heard back the very evening with a successful offer, some heard back a couple days after with a rejection and for me it’s now been one week with no updates. Was just wondering if there is a process firms go through or if it’s all random?

 

[fingersarecrossed]

@Jessica Booker

I have been offered a ~2.5 years apprenticeship programme where they fully sponsor my SQE 1&2, sponsor my studies under that SQE programe, and give me a rly good full time salary and QWE. (i've graduated with a 1st in law from a non-russell group uni)

I am somewhat relieved as the TC application process is exhausting and uncertain and feels hopeless at times. However, I also fear I will not receive the dynamic exposure to various sectors etc that city firms offer. I would love to hear your your opinions on this? If e.g., I specialise in conveyancing, will it be difficult to move to different sectors once I become NQ? Or should I just aim to pass my exams and continue as a paralegal until I receive a training contract at a city firm? I do not believe there are any strict requirements for me to complete the programme etc meaning I can exit at any time but it is not the sector I think I see myself working in (which I have made the firm aware of). Would it be better for me to continue as a paralegal or accept this programme (them sponsoring my SQE makes me want to say yes) but I just want to know if doing this apprenticeship will make me a 'weaker' candidate in a way as it is not a traditional TC format.

thank you so much in advance.

 

[Deleted member 37508]

What decides when people hear back from an AC? I had people in my AC that heard back the very evening with a successful offer, some heard back a couple days after with a rejection and for me it’s now been one week with no updates. Was just wondering if there is a process firms go through or if it’s all random?

Interviewer feedback may be taking longer to get. Sudden work load influx. busy graduate recruitment, this is her busiest time of year. Putting myself in your shoes in all honesty you’re probably average. They don’t want to reject you as you’ve passed to a good standard, what justification would they have the reject you if you were good enough. They may even debate moving you to another Vs intake like spring or summer. This is all my own opinion.

 

[Gday33]

Aaaa im sorry, if you don’t mind me asking which scheme was your application for? also what stage of the process was it?

I applied for the Spring VS on 12/10, didn’t make it past the initial paper sift - it was worth a punt I guess 😂

 

[l789]

For the Clifford chance insight day application question, it says “in no more than 500 words, please tell us why you want to attend this insight day and tell us about your extra-curricular activities, positions of responsibility and/OR an achievement of importance which you are most proud of. How will these experiences help you excel as a Clifford Chance lawyer?"

I’ve got 3 mini paragraphs (2) on why CC and (1) why the insight day conference - is this strong enough or should I draw upon why that specific insight day more - it’s a social mobility themed one?

Then I have 3 paragraphs on individual points referencing a position of responsibility and linking it back to the skills of a CC trainee.

I don’t have enough word count left and idk if 3 extra curricular activities/ position of responsibility and linking each to the skill of a trainee is a strong option or I should do 2 points on positions of responsibility/EC and then one on an achievement I’m most proud of ( also linking it the skills of a trainee)

I’m not sure which structure is better.

Sorry for the pathetic grammar, my hands are frozen, I’m in a rush, and I’m typing on my phone.

 

[pleasepleaseplease]

Just to add to @Jessica Booker's response, I think mentioning Chambers/Legal 500 rankings can be very useful for your reasoning around the firm's unique selling points in terms of practice areas strength and sector expertise. It is a way of evidencing your claims and placing the firm in the context if the market competition. However, as Jessica mentioned, it is essential to connect the point your are evidencing with the ranking with your motivations, interests and experiences - ie. why are you interested in working at a firm that has excellent renown for X practice area/sectors, and which of your work/other experiences reinforce this point?

Thanks - that makes sense!

 

[3000to1shoteverytime]

what does pfo mean?

Please f#&£ off

 

[andrecsaa]

I have advice. Use a calculator!

Today, I received my assessment results. I scored high in analysis, relationship building, and credibility, but low in adaptability.

The results indicate that Macfarlanes are reviewing my application. Do you think my scores will positively impact the review of my application for the training contract? How long did they send the outcome of your application?

 

[Jessica Booker]

When asked 'What led you to apply for firm's vacation scheme?', is that a combination of why law and why the firm? Do you also need to discuss what you hope to gain out of the vacation scheme? Would be hard to condense all three in a 2-3m response. Thanks in advance!

I think you can rely less on the "why law" aspect and focus more on the "why the firm" and then touch briefly upon what you hope to gain from the scheme.

 

[Jessica Booker]

@Jessica Booker

I have been offered a ~2.5 years apprenticeship programme where they fully sponsor my SQE 1&2, sponsor my studies under that SQE programe, and give me a rly good full time salary and QWE. (i've graduated with a 1st in law from a non-russell group uni)

I am somewhat relieved as the TC application process is exhausting and uncertain and feels hopeless at times. However, I also fear I will not receive the dynamic exposure to various sectors etc that city firms offer. I would love to hear your your opinions on this? If e.g., I specialise in conveyancing, will it be difficult to move to different sectors once I become NQ? Or should I just aim to pass my exams and continue as a paralegal until I receive a training contract at a city firm? I do not believe there are any strict requirements for me to complete the programme etc meaning I can exit at any time but it is not the sector I think I see myself working in (which I have made the firm aware of). Would it be better for me to continue as a paralegal or accept this programme (them sponsoring my SQE makes me want to say yes) but I just want to know if doing this apprenticeship will make me a 'weaker' candidate in a way as it is not a traditional TC format.

thank you so much in advance.

It being an apprenticeship is not an issue - you have got a training contract, you are just combining your SQE studies with work. This is not a "weaker" format of training - it is identical to a training contract, you just study concurrently rather then prior to your QWE.

However, there is a difference in the training model and the training opportunity. The training model is the way you study. The training opportunity is the exposure to the work you will do in your role.

What is difficult for me when answering this questions is not knowing what you will be doing during your 2.5 years of the programme (e.g. exposure to work). If this is just conveyancing work (as you are suggesting), you are most likely only going to work in conveyancing upon qualification and throughout your career. You may find it you can move into more general real estate work, but if you are doing private conveyancing work for individuals purchasing homes, its going to be tricky to then jump to global real estate assets. It would be very difficult to move to practice areas with no connection to what you have done during your training.

Although there won't be any restrictions of you leaving the programme, being part way through an apprenticeship is not without its issues. You will find it difficult to find another employer to pick up your existing academic training with your apprenticeship training provider. It's not impossible, butit'ss just an added factor employers would have to consider.

 

[Jessica Booker]

What decides when people hear back from an AC? I had people in my AC that heard back the very evening with a successful offer, some heard back a couple days after with a rejection and for me it’s now been one week with no updates. Was just wondering if there is a process firms go through or if it’s all random?

There are lots of very different factors that can influence this, so it can all be very random.