TCLA Vacation Scheme Applications Discussion Thread 2021-22 (#1)

[kmax301]

Is your AC the 17th March? 😊

Hi, is it for 2023 or 2024 tc?

 

[Beluga]

Hi all! Just curious if you can request changing the date of your vacation scheme (the firm runs two schemes over the summer) after signing the offer letter?

Hi Yuki! I have done this before — they had to put me on a waiting list because both were full but got back to me a few days later saying they could move me. If you need to change it I think nothing to lose if you just ask )

 

[James Carrabino]

After an AC, is it common practice to send an email to the interviewers thanking them for their time?

I always did - maybe this is a US thing but all my friends who did consulting recruitment in the US were told that interviewers looked to see if they received a thank you e-mail and that it could make the difference between two very equal candidates. That said, I do get the sense that it is not such an important thing in London TC/VS recruitment.

Regardless, I always believed that it was a polite gesture to send a kind note thanking the interviewer for their time. I also do this whenever anyone has a call with me or helps me out with something - it is good practice throughout one's career to recognise when others have invested their time on your behalf and thank them for it. I often received some really lovely responses (some even telling me how well they thought my interview went which I feel like they were not supposed to reveal)!

 

[George Maxwell]

I always did - maybe this is a US thing but all my friends who did consulting recruitment in the US were told that interviewers looked to see if they received a thank you e-mail and that it could make the difference between two very equal candidates. That said, I do get the sense that it is not such an important thing in London TC/VS recruitment.

Regardless, I always believed that it was a polite gesture to send a kind note thanking the interviewer for their time. I also do this whenever anyone has a call with me or helps me out with something - it is good practice throughout one's career to recognise when others have invested their time on your behalf and thank them for it. I often received some really lovely responses (some even telling me how well they thought my interview went which I feel like they were not supposed to reveal)!

Great to hear your insight regarding the US recruitment process James(!).

I never even considered that interviewers might incorporate this into their decision-making process. That being said, I think you are right about emails and UK firms.

 

[James Carrabino]

Strategically speaking, is it better to apply to the London office or other regional office of a firm for better chances at a TC? Regional offices have less vacancies but I assume they have less applicants as well.

Although on paper the odds might look better I'm not sure how successful this approach would be. How can you demonstrate how passionate you are for that job and that TC when the reality is that you are not you just want any TC. I can say that I get a lot more success with my apps when I can demonstrate I want that TC and that firm and that office by focusing on the sectors because its pretty clear I want to do tech transactions work than when I apply to just a city firm in general. Arguably I've had better odds on paper with the big firms as they offer more TCs per applicant but I've got much further through the process with US firms that have many more applicants per available TC when I can evidence why that particular TC and firm is the one I want.

Yes I think with all the firms you are applying to, the statistics are pretty irrelevant. They already have so few TCs per applicant that the actual number of TCs per applicant does not really make a difference to how hard you will find it getting a TC, even if one firm has three times more places per applicant than another firm.

As @Abii said, the thing that really makes a difference is how good of a fit you are for the firm you are applying to and how well prepared your application is! That will allow you to transcend even the most stringent odds much more easily than a mediocre application to a statistically less competitive firm.

 

[S87]

Great to hear your insight regarding the US recruitment process James(!).

I never even considered that interviewers might incorporate this into their decision-making process. That being said, I think you are right about emails and UK firms.

Actually, politeness and manners can play a great role, you don't need to be overly polite which sounds annoying but just give hints.
For example, one of the reasons why I have my job (and still have after 3 years) is that I came across as extremely kind and a pleasure to interview (actual feedback from the associate), I did not send an email but when I left the building I sincerely thanked the solicitor and also had a laugh with her. A picture is made of thousand of negatives!

 

[Adrian_S]

I'll be sending TCLA moderators thank you notes and taco bell when I get my training contract - for putting up with all my application psychodrama on this forum.

 

[James Carrabino]

Great to hear your insight regarding the US recruitment process James(!).

I never even considered that interviewers might incorporate this into their decision-making process. That being said, I think you are right about emails and UK firms.

I think they don't really here at all and I certainly didn't send e-mails with the goal of it helping me out! The US is keen on a lot of strange formalities and since careers advisers always said to write thank you e-mails (they are actually a lot more old-school than the UK in many ways) I got into the habit when I was there.

I just do it as a matter of practice and often I get no response, sometimes I get a one-line response and sometimes I get an e-mail that is just lovely and makes me really glad that I reached out! I can say that I never regretted sending a thank you e-mail and it only takes like 5 minutes

 

[James Carrabino]

I'll be sending TCLA moderators thank you notes and taco bell when I get my training contract - for putting up with all my application psychodrama on this forum.

This may just be a rumour, but I have heard that the managing partners of each magic circle firm liaise closely with taco bell to see which candidates have sent them thank-you e-mails...

 

[S87]

I think they don't really here at all and I certainly didn't send e-mails with the goal of it helping me out! The US is keen on a lot of strange formalities and since careers advisers always said to write thank you e-mails (they are actually a lot more old-school than the UK in many ways) I got into the habit when I was there.

I just do it as a matter of practice and often I get no response, sometimes I get a one-line response and sometimes I get an e-mail that is just lovely and makes me really glad that I reached out! I can say that I never regretted sending a thank you e-mail and it only takes like 5 minutes

I actually have an interview with an American company on Monday and currently drafting my interview answers. I think am going to use your approach.

 

[James Carrabino]

I actually have an interview with an American company on Monday and currently drafting my interview answers. I think am going to use your approach.

Again I do sense that it's not a culture here so I certainly would not feel any pressure to do so! But as you said in your previous post, being polite can never hurt

 

[Adrian_S]

I'm curious.

Assuming I need to re-apply for VS/TCs (a very plausible assumption given that I've bombed the only two VIs I've received), how bad does it look if I make points that are similar to those I made in a previous written application to the same firm?

For instance, do I need to have entirely different rationales for 'why law' or 'why this firm'? Or is it simply enough that I use more recent/different evidence to substantiate the same points that I made in a previous application? (Or perhaps some combination of both of these).

 

[GXA123]

I'm curious.

Assuming I need to re-apply for VS/TCs (a very plausible assumption given that I've bombed the only two VIs I've received), how bad does it look if I make points that are similar to those I made in a previous written application to the same firm? For instance, do I need to have entirely different rationales for 'why law' or 'why this firm'? Or is it simply that I should use more recent/different evidence to substantiate the same points that I made in a previous application? (Or maybe some combination of both of these).

combination, hope your VIs of go well <3

 

[Adrian_S]

combination, hope your VIs of go well <3

Thank you, you absolute angel!

 

[thirdtimelucky]

I'm curious.

Assuming I need to re-apply for VS/TCs (a very plausible assumption given that I've bombed the only two VIs I've received), how bad does it look if I make points that are similar to those I made in a previous written application to the same firm? For instance, do I need to have entirely different rationales for 'why law' or 'why this firm'? Or is it simply that I should use more recent/different evidence to substantiate the same points that I made in a previous application? (Or maybe some combination of both of these).

I think its always good to incorporate new experiences if you have them and develop/edit your applications but in my case I've had success at the same firm by only slightly editing my applications. I would say, however, that it helps to try and evaluate what you think went wrong with your applications this year and explore your interest in law if you can just so your answers are the best they can be

 

[James Carrabino]

I think they don't really here at all and I certainly didn't send e-mails with the goal of it helping me out! The US is keen on a lot of strange formalities and since careers advisers always said to write thank you e-mails (they are actually a lot more old-school than the UK in many ways) I got into the habit when I was there.

I just do it as a matter of practice and often I get no response, sometimes I get a one-line response and sometimes I get an e-mail that is just lovely and makes me really glad that I reached out! I can say that I never regretted sending a thank you e-mail and it only takes like 5 minutes

The law firm recruitment process in the US probably wouldn't go down super well here either:

First-stage interviews take place on campus at the different law schools and each firm will have a designated campus interviewer for each law school who will often be an alum of that law school currently working at the firm. To get a first-stage interview, you are only competing against other candidates from your law school and each law school will essentially have a designated number of places available at each firm. The campus interviewers then report back to graduate recruitment who arrange the final-stage interviews at the office.

Inevitably not every law school ends up getting included here. If you do not go to a T14 law school you may not have a recruiter from every firm assigned to your law school which would mean that you have to apply to the general applicant pool, where you have a far lower chance of getting an interview (almost all recruitment tends to be done on campus). In fact, the top law schools guarantee students at least one first-stage interview at the firm of their choice!

 

[S87]

I'm curious.

Assuming I need to re-apply for VS/TCs (a very plausible assumption given that I've bombed the only two VIs I've received), how bad does it look if I make points that are similar to those I made in a previous written application to the same firm?

For instance, do I need to have entirely different rationales for 'why law' or 'why this firm'? Or is it simply enough that I use more recent/different evidence to substantiate the same points that I made in a previous application? (Or perhaps some combination of both of these).

Can I be a bit brutal?

I would say both but also think why did I not succeed? Maybe those examples are good, but they might also not be good and you need to introduce new ones. If a product does not win then better change it! I am sorry but this is the approach that I would use for myself too.

 

[James Carrabino]

I'm curious.

Assuming I need to re-apply for VS/TCs (a very plausible assumption given that I've bombed the only two VIs I've received), how bad does it look if I make points that are similar to those I made in a previous written application to the same firm?

For instance, do I need to have entirely different rationales for 'why law' or 'why this firm'? Or is it simply enough that I use more recent/different evidence to substantiate the same points that I made in a previous application? (Or perhaps some combination of both of these).

I see no reason why the core motivation of your application should change at all. I would not copy your answer word for word and I would certainly add any updated details that continue to inform your motivations, but on the whole these answers should not need to change too much. The answers that I would change are those about 'Recent examples of a time when...' or those about recent commercial news stories!

 

[James Carrabino]

Can I be a bit brutal?

I would say both but also think why did I not succeed? Maybe those examples are good, but they might also not be good and you need to introduce new ones. If a product does not win then better change it! I am sorry but this is the approach that I would use for myself too.

I see no reason why the core motivation of your application should change at all. I would not copy your answer word for word and I would certainly add any updated details that continue to inform your motivations, but on the whole these answers should not need to change too much. The answers that I would change are those about 'Recent examples of a time when...' or those about recent commercial news stories!

Yes @S87 this is a good point - I would certainly search inside myself to see if there are better answers! But I was assuming that if your apps got you to the VI then they may have been good enough so it is more the VIs that need working on (although you may yet succeed, fingers crossed)!

 

[Adrian_S]

Can I be a bit brutal?

I would say both but also think why did I not succeed? Maybe those examples are good, but they might also not be good and you need to introduce new ones. If a product does not win then better change it! I am sorry but this is the approach that I would use for myself too.

Definitely! Thinking back about past application mistakes is a really important part of improving for the future.

I should have been more clear. I was mostly interested in cases where I've passed the initial written application stage and need to submit another application in a future cycle because, say, my VIs weren't as strong the first time around (and in my case, I'll defo need to practice VIs).