TCLA Direct Training Contract Applications Discussion Thread 2023-4

[evianmineral]

How do you know if you've passed the Macfarlanes test?

You receive an invite to the AC (to my knowledge none have gone out yet)

The SJT is not pass/fail its just about embodying the qualities/competencies they are looking for in a prospective trainee.

 

[LillyandSilver]

BCLP rejection, fed up at this point. That application was 2000 words long.

At the point where I might give up. I work 8-6 everyday and spend every other hour doing applications or tests. I’m exhausted, burnt out and depressed. I can’t take annual leave in case I need it for interviews but I’m not getting any. I wish I’d known earlier in uni how early you had to apply because it’s impossible to balance with work with applications and they’re so many years in advance that it’s pointless going through more cycles. I got interviews for vac schemes but I can’t do them because of work, direct TCs seem to be impossible to get in through.

I'm really sorry that you are facing this. Re direct routes, I've found that going after firms which don't do a vacation scheme works far better, doing this I've had several final interviews and assessment centres even with informal work experience and unassessed vacation schemes.

 

[PlscanIhaveaTC]

Has anyone used personal experiences to showcase determination/resilience during interviews?

 

[Lawlawlaw2]

Has anyone still not heard from WFW post-VI?

 

[A worried graduate]

How do you know if you've passed the Macfarlanes test?

It’s not a hard pass/fail but an extra to the form

 

[AspiringLawyer2002]

Has anyone received the Macfarlanes feedback report mentioned in the email?

 

[Izzy1026]

Has anyone received the Macfarlanes feedback report mentioned in the email?

It took about 48 hours for me to receive mine

 

[RonRod13]

BCLP rejection, fed up at this point. That application was 2000 words long.

At the point where I might give up. I work 8-6 everyday and spend every other hour doing applications or tests. I’m exhausted, burnt out and depressed. I can’t take annual leave in case I need it for interviews but I’m not getting any. I wish I’d known earlier in uni how early you had to apply because it’s impossible to balance with work with applications and they’re so many years in advance that it’s pointless going through more cycles. I got interviews for vac schemes but I can’t do them because of work, direct TCs seem to be impossible to get in through.

Bro just quit your job or do a masters or something?

 

[lawyerdreams]

Bro just quit your job or do a masters or something?

Not cool, nor helpful. Not many people can afford to just "quit their job" nor fund an entire masters program - its just not possible. A more productive suggestion would be to keep persevering - it only takes one yes! Maybe take a break from apps before the next cycle starts, and if VSs aren't possible, many firms so have TC routes they regularly recruit from (or even exclusively recruit from, like Fried Frank, Kennedys, Bristows)!

 

[RonRod13]

Not cool, nor helpful. Not many people can afford to just "quit their job" nor fund an entire masters program - its just not possible. A more productive suggestion would be to keep persevering - it only takes one yes! Maybe take a break from apps before the next cycle starts, and if VSs aren't possible, many firms so have TC routes they regularly recruit from (or even exclusively recruit from, like Fried Frank, Kennedys, Bristows)!

So your “productive” suggestion is to just keep doing what the user is already doing? Trying the exact same thing, using the exact same approach and then expecting different results is literally the definition of insanity…

 

[Jessica Booker]

So your “productive” suggestion is to just keep doing what the user is already doing? Trying the exact same thing, using the exact same approach and then expecting different results is literally the definition of insanity…

I’d stress that good candidates who try again are not just trying with the same set of skills/knowledge. Good candidates are ensuring they are focused on their self development and working out what to do to improve themself and their chances, and then making sure they accomplish that.

That isn’t insanity (because you are not doing the same thing over and over, you are changing), that is perseverance, a much needed skill if you want to be a lawyer.

We know so many candidates who have taken more than 4 cycles to get where they wanted to. Their perseverance paid off, and so it can do with others too.

 

[RonRod13]

I’d stress that good candidates who try again are not just trying with the same set of skills/knowledge. Good candidates are ensuring they are focused on their self development and working out what to do to improve themself and their chances, and then making sure they accomplish that.

That isn’t insanity (because you are not doing the same thing over and over, you are changing), that is perseverance, a much needed skill if you want to be a lawyer.

We know so many candidates who have taken more than 4 cycles to get where they wanted to. Their perseverance paid off, and so it can do with others too.

I don’t agree with this. It’s not as black and white as just needing “perseverance” and you will get your desired results. Yes this is an important skill but you need to know when to adopt this attribute. In this case, perseverance is just inefficient and a waste of the users resources and time.

The user is getting interviews for vac schemes, they just can’t do them due to work. They also can’t do vac schemes because of their work commitments and they are subsequently getting exhausted. It seems pretty clear what the common denominator is.

So, as much as self development and improvement is important, it’s going to be virtually useless unless the user changes their current environment.

So that’s why I think taking a break from work for maybe 6 - 12 months to really focus on applications and take part in vacation schemes might be more beneficial. Or taking on a less demanding job for the short term, going back into education etc.

Ultimately it will come down to the user knowing themselves and knowing their strengths and weaknesses and whether this is a valid trade off to make.

 

[Maddy]

Is it considered to be negative to submit an application few days before a rolling application? I am planning to submit my application tomorrow for Hogan Lovells.

 

[A worried graduate]

So your “productive” suggestion is to just keep doing what the user is already doing? Trying the exact same thing, using the exact same approach and then expecting different results is literally the definition of insanity…

Wouldn’t it just make more sense to maybe find a job that can allow him to make money but doesn’t stop him from taking a vac scheme or at least lets him have a rest

 

[Jessica Booker]

I don’t agree with this. It’s not as black and white as just needing “perseverance” and you will get your desired results. Yes this is an important skill but you need to know when to adopt this attribute. In this case, perseverance is just inefficient and a waste of the users resources and time.

The user is getting interviews for vac schemes, they just can’t do them due to work. They also can’t do vac schemes because of their work commitments and they are subsequently getting exhausted. It seems pretty clear what the common denominator is.

So, as much as self development and improvement is important, it’s going to be virtually useless unless the user changes their current environment.

So that’s why I think taking a break from work for maybe 6 - 12 months to really focus on applications and take part in vacation schemes might be more beneficial. Or taking on a less demanding job for the short term, going back into education etc.

Ultimately it will come down to the user knowing themselves and knowing their strengths and weaknesses and whether this is a valid trade off to make.

As someone else has mentioned, just leaving a job isn't necessarily the answer though. That could bring more pressures, particularly financial.

The common denominator you have actually identified is applying to the wrong type of vacancy. There is little point applying to something you can't actually do. Instead, applying for direct TCs would be the far better option if that is the case. If the person is getting interviews, then they are more likely to continue to secure these for the right opportunities they are applying to.

Plus there are a load of other solutions rather than just quitting a job. The individual could ask for flexible working hours or a short period of unpaid leave to help with the time commitment. A 6-12 month break is excessive and isn't without risks - they could look more "flighty" if they are chopping and changing what they do. Taking a block of time across a small number of weeks or changing their working hours to get one afternoon off per week could give the necessary amount of time to focus on what they need to do.

 

[Jessica Booker]

Is it considered to be negative to submit an application few days before a rolling application? I am planning to submit my application tomorrow for Hogan Lovells.

Its not a negative, but at the same time you don't necessarily need to rush it. Applying in the first two-thirds of an application window is usually more than sufficient to be ahead of other applicants.

If your application is ready then go for it though - being prepared so early is never a negative!

 

[banana1189]

Anyone heard from Penningtons?

 

[Victor87]

Hey guys, is it too late to send in a Paul Hastings TC app? (are their apps rolling?)

 

[bangarangbass39]

Is there much difference between a paralegal and a legal assistant? I imagine there most definitely is a difference, so I want to be clear on the role I am applying for.

My local council has a vacancy for a Legal assistant in Childcare. I feel it would be great experience whilst I wait to apply for TC/VS. I do have a reservation on whether I can make a strong application.

It says "Essential Criteria = CILEx LLB Hons Law or Level 3 qualified (or working towards CILEx level 3) or a similar qualification, or relevant experience in Law./Desirable Criteria = Further academic qualification e.g. Law degree."

For context, I am a History MA grad. I have about 4 weeks' worth of legal experience and insight, along with other work experience such as researching, tutoring, and mentoring. I'm aware it will be a matter of "apply and find out" but I thought it would be good to ask if there is a way to make myself stand out despite my obvious setback (lack of a legal degree).

 

[Jessica Booker]

Is there much difference between a paralegal and a legal assistant? I imagine there most definitely is a difference, so I want to be clear on the role I am applying for.

My local council has a vacancy for a Legal assistant in Childcare. I feel it would be great experience whilst I wait to apply for TC/VS. I do have a reservation on whether I can make a strong application.

It says "Essential Criteria = CILEx LLB Hons Law or Level 3 qualified (or working towards CILEx level 3) or a similar qualification, or relevant experience in Law./Desirable Criteria = Further academic qualification e.g. Law degree."

For context, I am a History MA grad. I have about 4 weeks' worth of legal experience and insight, along with other work experience such as researching, tutoring, and mentoring. I'm aware it will be a matter of "apply and find out" but I thought it would be good to ask if there is a way to make myself stand out despite my obvious setback (lack of a legal degree).

There is not necessarily a difference - it can just be the job title that firms like to use, but they are often interchangable.

What area is your legal work experience in? If that aligns with the topics this role would cover or if its in a similar public sector organisation, it might be worth a punt.