General Discussion Thread 2020-21

[avocadotoast]

Thought my FF app was one of the best ones I wrote ... clearly not haha for me to not even get a WG Test.

Good luck to all!

I thought my personal statement was really good too! Genuinely surprised by the outcome

Virtual toast to all of us though loool

 

[Tintin06]

You can technically ask for it.. they can just still say no...

Although I don't think in this instance it is worth it, technically you could put in a SAR to request the feedback.

SARs are useful but don't they make extra work for grad rec and possibly lead to an applicant being viewed less favourably if they were to reapply? Just a concern I have.

 

[E.A]

Rejected from FF too. Quite disheartening when I thought it was strong and I got through to WG last cycle when my personal statement was not as good as this personal statement (have gained extensive experience since and got it good feedback from associates who reviewed it). Oh well, shows that sometimes it doesn't work even when you genuinely know you are a 'better candidate'. Just have to keep going then

 

[Jessica Booker]

SARs are useful but don't they make extra work for grad rec and possibly lead to an applicant being viewed less favourably if they were to reapply? Just a concern I have.

Would have to rely on Grad Rec recording that detail, remembering the name, and then being petty enough to apply that thinking.

Obviously a risk though (which is why I said it probably isn't worth it on this occasion, along with the fact the feedback could be vague/unhelpful even when you do get it).

Just stating the facts about you could technically ask for feedback through a SAR and the firm would have to provide it! A firm would probably then just give the feedback and try to stop you from doing the SAR because of the additional work needed for SAR, compared to just providing feedback.

 

[33c]

Rejected from Freshfields

Also rejected from FF! Not surprised but a shame as thought it was one of my better applications.

Also rejected from FF!

So sorry to hear this! If you don't mind me asking, was this a pre or post-WG rejection?

 

[Law123]

@Jessica Booker

On a vacation scheme, I have been asked to write a report to a client less than 1 A4 page, what format and structure should I use for this, any precedent I can follow? Thank you!!

 

[Jessica Booker]

@Jessica Booker

On a vacation scheme, I have been asked to write a report to a client less than 1 A4 page, what format and structure should I use for this, any precedent I can follow? Thank you!!

Is this actual work or a simulation?

 

[anulciak7]

Anyone else heard from Addleshaw Goddard or Stephenson Harwood?

 

[Law2022]

Anyone else heard from Addleshaw Goddard or Stephenson Harwood?

I am waiting on these two also!

 

[S87]

Anyone else heard from Addleshaw Goddard or Stephenson Harwood?

still waiting to hear from AG

 

[Mia97]

Rejected from FF too. Quite disheartening when I thought it was strong and I got through to WG last cycle when my personal statement was not as good as this personal statement (have gained extensive experience since and got it good feedback from associates who reviewed it). Oh well, shows that sometimes it doesn't work even when you genuinely know you are a 'better candidate'. Just have to keep going then

I totally agree ! I remember last year I didn't get to WG for FF but my friend did and went onto AC. When I viewed at her app afterwards I was shocked. It was littered with typos, she had spelt the firm name wrong and included lots of generic statements e.g. "I want to work at FF as it is Magic Circle firm and has big M&A deals " . Plus she had no legal experience- however great grades.

Was frustrating at the time but ultimately I really believe rejections redirect us to the right firm for us. Ended up much happier with the TC offer I have now- so please keep going xxx

 

[E.A]

I totally agree ! I remember last year I didn't get to WG for FF but my friend did and went onto AC. When I viewed at her app afterwards I was shocked. It was littered with typos, she had spelt the firm name wrong and included lots of generic statements e.g. "I want to work at FF as it is Magic Circle firm and has big M&A deals " . Plus she had no legal experience- however great grades.

Was frustrating at the time but ultimately I really believe rejections redirect us to the right firm for us. Ended up much happier with the TC offer I have now- so please keep going xxx

Thank you for sharing that! Yes, I have also heard of people getting through with typos and there is no doubt it is frustrating when you put weeks into writing an app. But, as you said, everything does happen for a reason, and I guess it is also important to remember that there is quite a bit of luck involved and a numbers game too. Thanks for sharing and well done on your TC xx

 

[S87]

Well they Pressed the button muahahahah

 

[madge]

It is possible, but very, very difficult, and I'd definitely query the "many" bit of what you've read. The point is that naturally commercial law isn't everyone's cup of tea - the subject matter, the hours and so on dissuade a lot of people. On top of that, a lot of people really don't understand exactly what a commercial lawyer does when they first think of applying.

From a firm's point of view, it's much better that if they make you a TC offer - a costly and time-consuming process, - you already have evidence that you already have some semblance of an idea of what the work/life of a corporate lawyer is, so you are less likely to drop out or cause havoc by falling behind on work, will require less unnecessary handholding, and so on. Having a VS at a commercial law firm shows that at least in part you can handle this life and have an understanding of what goes on/what is expected of you.

I know two people who managed to get a TC without a VS first: one had done a stack of mini-pupillages at some of the top commercial barristers' chambers, the other had interned at the ICC. It's not impossible, but it really isn't very common either.

The other point of the "many people" is exactly where they got offered a TC. This isn't meant in a snobbish sense, just that some smaller and less elaborate firms might be more willing to do this than a Moneylaw/MC/SC/WS firm, which was probably what the blog (and most people on this forum/legalcheek commenters etc) are thinking of.

Lastly, it's worth remembering that quite a few firms exclusively recruit from their vac schemes (Davis Polk, Jones Day, HSF, Ropes & Gray, Shearman & Sterling, etc); theoretically recruit from outside their VS but don't in reality (Skadden, Kirkland & Ellis); or give the overwhelming majority of their offers to vac schemers (Linklaters & the rest of the MC), so your odds of getting a TC by direct application range from comparatively slim to zilch.

Thank you for your in depth response! Thanks everyone for their responses, it’s been really helpful.

 

[orange32]

Just got rejected by Freshfields for TC. Haven't heard back from Hogan Lovells post WG yet - anyone in same position?

 

[AverageHotSauce]

Did anyone hear back from Linklaters? Does anyone know if they sent out AC yet?

 

[SLKEJRWOI97]

Just got rejected by Freshfields for TC. Haven't heard back from Hogan Lovells post WG yet - anyone in same position?

Haven’t heard back from HL either post WG. I know that others have though but not too sure whether they’re rejecting in batches or ..

 

[madge]

Rejection from Addleshaw Goddard! Hope everyone hears back soon!

 

[billalchowdhury]

Just received a rejection from Freshfields pre-WG. Currently waiting on Hogan Lovells post-WG and from Slaughter and May after providing my second year results.

 

[Tintin06]

Would have to rely on Grad Rec recording that detail, remembering the name, and then being petty enough to apply that thinking.

Obviously a risk though (which is why I said it probably isn't worth it on this occasion, along with the fact the feedback could be vague/unhelpful even when you do get it).

Just stating the facts about you could technically ask for feedback through a SAR and the firm would have to provide it! A firm would probably then just give the feedback and try to stop you from doing the SAR because of the additional work needed for SAR, compared to just providing feedback.

Although I'd hope showing the initiative to use FOIs or Subject Access Requests could count in our favour