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TCLA Vacation Scheme Applications Discussion Thread 2024-25

Ram Sabaratnam

Administrator
Staff member
Gold Member
Premium Member
Sep 7, 2024
75
157
Bird & Bird Post WG PFO. Quite gutted as it was the only good piece of news I’ve had since starting this journey.

Does anyone have any good tips for tackling the WG? I’ve been practising but clearly not enough :(

Hi @SamiyaJ :)

Sorry to hear about the rejection – it's definitely frustrating, especially when you’ve been putting in a lot of effort to master this aspect of the application process. The Watson Glaser test is tricky for many, but I think with the right approach, you can definitely improve your performance on these.

Understand the style of reasoning required for each section: As I'm sure you already know, the Watson Glaser test covers five areas: inferences, recognising assumptions, deduction, interpretation, and evaluation of arguments. While doing practice tests is a great start, it's far more important to fully understand the subtle differences between these question types. One thing I've noticed is that many applicants often struggle to understand the difference, for instance, between deductions and inferences. Doing successive practice tests without understanding the type of reasoning required of each section could ultimately frustrate your efforts. So the first thing I'd suggest is really taking time to think about what the section is asking for and why certain answers are correct or incorrect.

Identifying Premises and Conclusions: A particularly helpful strategy is learning how to break down passages into premises and conclusions. This skill is crucial because once you’ve identified the premises (the supporting facts or evidence) and the conclusion (the main point the premises are trying to establish), you can then better identify the assumptions, deductions, or inferences that relate to the passage. Many questions in the Watson Glaser test revolve around how the conclusion is derived from the premises, and spotting this relationship will put you in a much stronger position to answer correctly. I would REALLY REALLY encourage getting into the habit of breaking down anything you read into premises and conclusions. That way, if the question asks about assumptions, you can think more clearly about what's missing between the premises and the conclusion. If it’s about inferences, you’ll need to assess whether a conclusion strongly follows from the premises. For deductions, the conclusion must be an inevitable result of the premises.

Learning Resources: There are great short textbooks that can help clarify the underlying logical concepts and styles of reasoning, and I'd be happy to share some with you. Do let me know. For a more affordable approach, though, you can just use ChatGPT. For instance, you could ask it to provide more examples of each type of question, explaining why a particular answer is a deduction, inference, or assumption. ChatGPT can also help break down the difference between styles of reasoning, helping you understand the difference between, say, a deduction and more probabilistic forms of reasoning. This makes it a useful tool for both learning and practising critical thinking in a more interactive way.

Practicing Under Timed Conditions: Finally, once you feel more comfortable with the test, start practising under timed conditions. Some Watson Glaser tests are timed, so developing both accuracy and speed can be important. But don’t worry about speed in the beginning – focus on getting the logic right first. For some firms, speed will play an important role in determining your percentile score, while others may weigh certain sections or types of questions more heavily.

Overall, it's important to remember that logical reasoning is a skill that we develop, much like any other skill. It will take time, but I've got faith you can do it! Let me know if you have any other questions, and I'd be happy to assist!
 
Last edited:

Ram Sabaratnam

Administrator
Staff member
Gold Member
Premium Member
Sep 7, 2024
75
157
Is there any point applying to a from in which you’ve been rejected for thier open day? Because surely there’s a higher threshold for vacation schemes? Has any one experienced this?

Absolutely!!! I was rejected from Cooley's open day! Please don't let it put you off! There are loads of reasons why firms might have rejected you from the open day, including that you might not have really benefitted from it as much as other candidates and that you might even be better suited to applying directly to the vacation scheme or training contract. That said, I wouldn't submit the same application, but try to improve on any application you've previously submitted to the firm. Good luck!
 

SamiyaJ

Distinguished Member
Gold Member
Premium Member
Apr 16, 2024
62
82
Hi, I used this link someone posted last year.


I used this guide and found it helped me look at the test more holistically. It’s also helped with my critical thinking more broadly. I hope this helps. Otherwise loads of practise with Assessment Day or JobTestPrep.

Good luck!
Thank you so much!
 
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SamiyaJ

Distinguished Member
Gold Member
Premium Member
Apr 16, 2024
62
82
Hi @SamiyaJ :)

Sorry to hear about the rejection – it's definitely frustrating, especially when you’ve been putting in a lot of effort to master this aspect of the application process. The Watson Glaser test is tricky for many, but I think with the right approach, you can definitely improve your performance on these.

Understand the style of reasoning required for each section: As I'm sure you already know, the Watson Glaser test covers five areas: inferences, recognising assumptions, deduction, interpretation, and evaluation of arguments. While doing practice tests is a great start, it's far more important to fully understand the subtle differences between these question types. One thing I've noticed is that many applicants often struggle to understand the difference, for instance, between deductions and inferences. Doing successive practice tests without understanding the type of reasoning required of each section could ultimately frustrate your efforts. So the first thing I'd suggest is really taking time to think about what the section is asking for and why certain answers are correct or incorrect.

Identifying Premises and Conclusions: A particularly helpful strategy is learning how to break down passages into premises and conclusions. This skill is crucial because once you’ve identified the premises (the supporting facts or evidence) and the conclusion (the main point the premises are trying to establish), you can then better identify the assumptions, deductions, or inferences that relate to the passage. Many questions in the Watson Glaser test revolve around how the conclusion is derived from the premises, and spotting this relationship will put you in a much stronger position to answer correctly. I would REALLY REALLY encourage getting into the habit of breaking down anything you read into premises and conclusions. That way, if the question asks about assumptions, you can think more clearly about what's missing between the premises and the conclusion. If it’s about inferences, you’ll need to assess whether a conclusion strongly follows from the premises. For deductions, the conclusion must be an inevitable result of the premises.

Learning Resources: There are great short textbooks that can help clarify the underlying logical concepts and styles of reasoning, and I'd be happy to share some with you. Do let me know. For a more affordable approach, though, you can just use ChatGPT. For instance, you could ask it to provide more examples of each type of question, explaining why a particular answer is a deduction, inference, or assumption. ChatGPT can also help break down the difference between styles of reasoning, helping you understand the difference between, say, a deduction and more probabilistic forms of reasoning. This makes it a useful tool for both learning and practising critical thinking in a more interactive way.

Practicing Under Timed Conditions: Finally, once you feel more comfortable with the test, start practising under timed conditions. Some Watson Glaser tests are timed, so developing both accuracy and speed can be important. But don’t worry about speed in the beginning – focus on getting the logic right first. For some firms, speed will play an important role in determining your percentile score, while others may weigh certain sections or types of questions more heavily.

Overall, it's important to remember that logical reasoning is a skill that we develop, much like any other skill. It will take time, but I've got faith you can do it! Let me know if you have any other questions, and I'd be happy to assist!
Thank you Ram for taking the time to explain! It’s super helpful. You’re absolutely right, I think it’s the inferences and deductions that throw me off.

On to the next one!!!
 
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GMAC

Active Member
Gold Member
Premium Member
Jan 9, 2023
18
37
I made quite a few applications this cycle. Within the first week, I got a PFO from Jones Day and thought, here we go again... But then I said PFO to Jones Day and kept going. Today, I received W&C and HSF AC invites!!! Don't let the rejections get to you; feel it momentarily, but let it light that fire to do more applications. Wish me luck and good luck to all of you!
 

Andrei Radu

Legendary Member
Staff member
Future Trainee
Gold Member
Premium Member
Sep 9, 2024
167
235
@Andrei Radu or @Ram Sabaratnam

Can I ask if there's something similar to this but for VIs instead of AC interviews?
Hi @Aspiringsolicitor01! I do not think there is on because AC interview questions are a lot more expansive than VI questions. Since VI questions tend to be more formulaic and predictable, a question bank for AC questions will likely automatically include most questions you can expect in a VI.

From my own and others' experience, VI questions tend to fit into one of the following categories:
  • The classics: Why you, Why the firm, Why commercial law - these almost always feature in one form or another.
  • Further motivational questions: Why did you initially decide to study law, What other careers did you consider, What do you like and dislike about different types of work, what practice areas/sectors are you interested in etc.
  • Competency questions: Tell me about a time you demonstrated teamwork skills/time-management/innovation/creative thinking/integrity etc.
  • Situational judgement questions: What would you do in X scenario (eg. you have multiple competing deadline and you feel your work product will suffer as a result)
  • General commercial awareness question: tell us about a news story you have been following and what are its impacts on the economy/the legal market/the firm/the firm's clients, what is a business you admire, who are the firm's competitors and how do you distinguish it? why do the firm's clients keep coming back?
Besides variations of these types of questions, the only other type of question you should prepare for is potential curveballs. However, you can't really predict a curveball, so the only thing you can do it to try to train yourself to think quickly and be flexible in how you leverage your experience. For that purpose, I think you can use the AC interview question bank.
 

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