TCLA Vacation Scheme Applications Discussion Thread 2023-24

[Petallove1]

Is anyone else still waiting for HSF? Because I see some people are invited for AC's and others got rejected, but I did not get rejected or selected 🥲.

Also, how long does it take to get the results for Arctic Shores.

I’m in exactly the same boat!! I’m also worried because I start work as a paralegal in the city next week 😭 and not sure if I did get to AC I would now be able to get the time off so last minute

 

[trainingcontract]

hsf pfo : D

 

[spamelinazoid]

I'm sure you're a great person but they just didn't like you.

This process is not about choosing the smartest, most hard working people.

In fact, they probably don't want that trainee inadvertently affecting fragile associate or partner egos.

So they only hire people they like or the client would like to see, fill any quotas for PR, and even choose those they want to hit on later.

The greatest thing you can do is accept this. Beauty pageants are not just in law. Sometimes it helps to be a little ditzy and dumb.

Controversial but I agree. The #1 thing some firms look for when hiring trainees is if they like you, not necessarily if you are the smartest. And its not always the Partners that dont like you - you can get great feedback from your partner/associate interviews but GR may dislike you for whatever reason. This was exactly the case for me when I applied as a trainee for the firm I paralegal at. My department was shocked when I didnt get it, especially since my interview feedback was really good. After speaking internally to people from other departments, the consensus was that GR just didnt like like me, even though my performance as a paralegal had been great thus far and I did very well in my interviews - my point is, it’s not always your performance that they dont like. It might be various factors outside of your control, some may be unconscious biases GR or an interviewer hold against you. Or you might just not fit the trainee profile for that specific cohort.

And to reflect the point above - I agree, they dont always hire the smartest people. Colleagues have confirmed this as well. They hire the people that are easiest to work with, which definitely doesnt have to mean the smartest. Which is why so much emphasis is put on group tasks in some firms.

 

[jnice]

Does anyone know when DLA Piper closed their applications last year? I know that they close as soon as they have enough applicants to fill their spots. I'm still working on my application and getting stressed that they will close before I'm ready to send it 😣

You still have time! The deadline is 31 December. I applied 8 November last year.

 

[Minitomatosalad]

Controversial but I agree. The #1 thing some firms look for when hiring trainees is if they like you, not necessarily if you are the smartest. And its not always the Partners that dont like you - you can get great feedback from your partner/associate interviews but GR may dislike you for whatever reason. This was exactly the case for me when I applied as a trainee for the firm I paralegal at. My department was shocked when I didnt get it, especially since my interview feedback was really good. After speaking internally to people from other departments, the consensus was that GR just didnt like like me, even though my performance as a paralegal had been great thus far and I did very well in my interviews - my point is, it’s not always your performance that they dont like. It might be various factors outside of your control, some may be unconscious biases GR or an interviewer hold against you. Or you might just not fit the trainee profile for that specific cohort.

And to reflect the point above - I agree, they dont always hire the smartest people. Colleagues have confirmed this as well. They hire the people that are easiest to work with, which definitely doesnt have to mean the smartest. Which is why so much emphasis is put on group tasks in some firms.

This is interesting. I didn’t know GR had that much power to decide who they like or not. In the end partners and associates will have to work with the trainee and like them so why would GR’s subjective option matter so much?
the only reason that would come to mind is that GR know the kind of person that would be liked in the firm? but then that goes against the claim many firms make regarding welcoming a diverse set of characters.

 

[spamelinazoid]

It's cos they don't want to deal with fragile associate and partner egos later on.

Boring, safe, only visual trainees are set it and forget it. Even if a particular team is OK with a paralegal.

What I was trying to get at before naive white knights piled on.

They want the most trainable trainee, not necessarily the smartest. Its nice if its both, but from what Ive seen and from what colleagues have said, they want 1) the most trainable and 2) the easiest to work with.

 

[spamelinazoid]

This is interesting. I didn’t know GR had that much power to decide who they like or not. In the end partners and associates will have to work with the trainee and like them so why would GR’s subjective option matter so much?
the only reason that would come to mind is that GR know the kind of person that would be liked in the firm? but then that goes against the claim many firms make regarding welcoming a diverse set of characters.

Might not be the same in every firm, but it was definitely the case in mine. And there’s firms where GR is the main deciding factor in hiring a trainee.

And in theory they should know who fits the firm profile best, but in practice a lot of the GR teams tend to be younger than the trainees with only a few years of experience in recruitment…with the exception of the head GR who is more senior.

 

[spamelinazoid]

Friend of mine had a similar story to yours.

HR in charge of grads was a just qualified apprentice with only a BTEC in Theatre Studies previously.

Needless to say, his team were shocked too. Computer says no at its finest.

it’s a really stupid reality. Especially since the paralegals who work in these firms are so much more qualified for the jobs than the 2-3rd yr students that get the offers. There’s no comparison in terms of knowledge and abilities. It all comes down to likeability and trainability in some/many places.

 

[jl30]

Is anyone else still waiting for HSF? Because I see some people are invited for AC's and others got rejected, but I did not get rejected or selected 🥲.

Also, how long does it take to get the results for Arctic Shores.

I am still waiting! I have friends who completed and passed the Online Assessment later than me have already got the rejection email. So i guess no news is good news?🤷🏻‍♂️

 

[pfotherecord]

Anyone else heard from Sidley?

I received an interview invite last week (Wednesday), and have the interview this Friday. For a little more context, I applied on 8/10.

 

[Flavius Aurelius]

No it is only 8. The memory game, energy game, directions, team, ticket, balloon, face game, and security. The additional two are for other type of firms I think like PwC.

Awesome mate, thanks very much and best of luck!

 

[Flavius Aurelius]

Congrats! When did you apply?

Thanks, I applied on October 8th quite close to the deadline.

 

[Tintin06]

it’s a really stupid reality. Especially since the paralegals who work in these firms are so much more qualified for the jobs than the 2-3rd yr students that get the offers. There’s no comparison in terms of knowledge and abilities. It all comes down to likeability and trainability in some/many places.

Yes. I also wonder if once a firm sees someone as a paralegal it’s hard to go beyond that (like being in a sort of friend zone). I just think some firms will always have a bias for younger people who can get it first time. I don’t mean to be harsh, but how many paralegals set out to do that job? Again, it’s not a criticism of anyone who does it, but I just know some firms like S&M and FF seem to really like hiring people fresh out of university (I think US firms value real world experience more as it’s more work being a trainee at a US firm from what I’ve found). I’m 26 (still in this game because I can’t get anything right first time, or the second or the third or the fourth) and I often think long and hard before applying to firms. My pitch is essentially that I’m not the smartest (62% in my degree), but I’m good at making money, earning more than pretty much any trainee out there and law firms are businesses. It’s a stark reality, but you really do have to impress everyone, including GR who are the gateway to the Partners. Funnily enough, I got feedback from a VS that I basically just ignored the paralegals and the other Vac Schemers and wasn’t a team player. I’m not a team player: I took my exams as an individual and am now self-employed, but this is still an important quality. I’ve applied for firms with smaller intakes because I don’t like big groups and also I want a higher NQ salary without this being diluted and reduced by having loads of fellow NQs.

 

[Tintin06]

It might actually be to your disadvantage sadly. How much does a 20 something grad HR know about Corporate Biz Dev? They're probably thinking "not boring, not safe, more work later".

Plus they probably don't know how to score it in their little computer says no boxes. Having the exact same process for all ages, law and non law is still bizarre. And 90 sec snippet video answers for all experiences.

Then if you're lucky to pass the gateway, you get an associate or partner who's either threatened by your Corporate Biz Dev potential or just wants a boring, safe, visual empty vessel too.

I genuinely think it might be better to treat it as a pageant rather than showing off that you can make them more money.

Sure, but from a firm's perspective, you can't afford to be paying NQs or Trainees to run the whole GR process, can you? It's a tick box exercise, largely. I made lots of mistakes in the first few years of applying. HR, GR exist to help the firm, not you. That said, there are some super stars out there who go out of their way to provide actionable pointers, like the Shearman guy. Also, I actually think subjective processes are better. The WG often has quite arbitrary cutoffs. They didn’t have in the past and law firms did just fine. It’s just a lot, honestly.

 

[F12M34L]

Is it too late to apply for HL WVS? thinking to hold off my app for summer VS instead

 

[lonelycruise]

I received an interview invite last week (Wednesday), and have the interview this Friday. For a little more context, I applied on 8/10.

Congrats -- that's awesome!

I only applied two days after you... Hope that's not a troubling sign...

 

[Legalstalker]

Congrats -- that's awesome!

I only applied two days after you... Hope that's not a troubling sign...

I also applied on the 10th and have not received anything! slightly worrying!!

 

[babylawyer1942]

Congrats -- that's awesome!

I only applied two days after you... Hope that's not a troubling sign...

I applied on 29/09 and still haven't heard. Sidley's turnaround time is meant to be quick so I am worried

 

[TS2001]

Has anyone heard back from Ashurst for an Interview yet? For context I completed their Assessment Centre on 16/10. Thanks!

 

[Saumya]

Slaughters winter workshop PFO - a bit gutted, thought my cover letter was very strong. Oh well

hi @prospectiveswitcher
I am sorry to hear! I am sure better things r coming you way
May I ask when did you apply