Ask 3 future trainees (Magic & Silver Circle, International Elite) ANYTHING! *New TCLA Team Members*

[Tarnjeet]

Hey @Jacob Miller

For the Travers Smith Vacation Scheme applicants have to submit a cover letter. I have read that cover letters should be one-page long, but as there are no questions in the application about Why Commercial Law or Why Travers (which in other applications are usually expected to be around 300 words) this seems quite short. Travers have stated that there is no word limit (Ashurst, who also require a cover letter in addition to their application letters, have a word limit of 1000 words).

Do you think its okay in this case if my cover letter is over one page?

Also do you think that I should include anything on why I am suitable for the role/skills that I have in the cover letter (the application does ask for i)details of any positions of responsibility and achievements, ii)details of your main extra-curricular activities and leisure interests, iii)work experience section in other sections of its application)?

Thanks,

 

[Jacob Miller]

Hey @Jacob Miller

For the Travers Smith Vacation Scheme applicants have to submit a cover letter. I have read that cover letters should be one-page long, but as there are no questions in the application about Why Commercial Law or Why Travers (which in other applications are usually expected to be around 300 words) this seems quite short. Travers have stated that there is no word limit (Ashurst, who also require a cover letter in addition to their application letters, have a word limit of 1000 words).

Do you think its okay in this case if my cover letter is over one page?

Also do you think that I should include anything on why I am suitable for the role/skills that I have in the cover letter (the application does ask for i)details of any positions of responsibility and achievements, ii)details of your main extra-curricular activities and leisure interests, iii)work experience section in other sections of its application)?

Thanks,

Hey, thanks for asking!

In terms of the length of the CL, mine was actually around 2 pages, but I had a fully-formatted, double-spaced letter format at the top which took up half the first page, so the actual content was only around a page and a half. Depending on who yo ask, you'll get different responses to whether this formatting is necessary (personally I always did it and would continue to if I was still making applications as I think it adds to the overall presentation when done properly), so don't worry too much about that.

In terms of what you should include in the CL, I can't honestly remember what other sections there are within the app as I completed it so long ago- I would suggest clicking through it to find what other sections there are (if there are any at all, they may even have changed it since I applied). If there are no other sections, I would tend to advise focussing the CL on:
- Why commercial law
- Why Travers
- Why you (this is where relevant experience comes into play).

I wouldn't try and squeeze all your work experience into the CL as there will definitely be a work experience section where you can put information like that. Generally speaking, avoid EC's in the work experience category unless they are highly relevant.

 

[Tarnjeet]

Hey, thanks for asking!

In terms of the length of the CL, mine was actually around 2 pages, but I had a fully-formatted, double-spaced letter format at the top which took up half the first page, so the actual content was only around a page and a half. Depending on who yo ask, you'll get different responses to whether this formatting is necessary (personally I always did it and would continue to if I was still making applications as I think it adds to the overall presentation when done properly), so don't worry too much about that.

In terms of what you should include in the CL, I can't honestly remember what other sections there are within the app as I completed it so long ago- I would suggest clicking through it to find what other sections there are (if there are any at all, they may even have changed it since I applied). If there are no other sections, I would tend to advise focussing the CL on:
- Why commercial law
- Why Travers
- Why you (this is where relevant experience comes into play).

I wouldn't try and squeeze all your work experience into the CL as there will definitely be a work experience section where you can put information like that. Generally speaking, avoid EC's in the work experience category unless they are highly relevant.

@Jacob Miller Thank you

 

[Lauren]

Hi,

I was wondering how to tackle the question, 'What are your strengths?'. I have been struggling with how broad this is.

I was planning on mentioning thinking outside the box and linking this to an experience of volunteering for a consulting firm and running a glitter tattoo business.

Also, providing tailored service to customers and linking this to my experiences as LexisNexis Student Associate and Open Day ambassador.

However, do these overlap too much and are they worthy strengths to highlight?

Also is two enough or should I highlight three in lesser detail?

I am trying to avoid generic strengths like organisation, communication etc.

 

[Jacob Miller]

Hi,

I was wondering how to tackle the question, 'What are your strengths?'. I have been struggling with how broad this is.

I was planning on mentioning thinking outside the box and linking this to an experience of volunteering for a consulting firm and running a glitter tattoo business.

Also, providing tailored service to customers and linking this to my experiences as LexisNexis Student Associate and Open Day ambassador.

However, do these overlap too much and are they worthy strengths to highlight?

Also is two enough or should I highlight three in lesser detail?

I am trying to avoid generic strengths like organisation, communication etc.

Hmm, this is definitely a challenging question to answer- simply due to the number of directions in which you could take it! I personally answered this question across three key bases, highlighting individual skills each of which I felt were representative of a wider skill-base which was, in turn, important in some way to commercial law. To that end, I would recommend starting to plan your answer by identifying different broad areas and categories of skills that you feel are important to the career (you may wish to consider a combination of both 'soft' and 'hard' skills here) and then think of specific things within each of those groups that represent them well. Match those to examples you feel are relevant and then build your actual answers from there! One caveat I would put here is that you want to mainly focus on skills required to be a successful trainee: it wouldn't be relevant (in my opinion) to bring up sales experience, for example, and then link this to the idea of selling the law firm to potential clients, as this is something that a Partner would be doing. In any event, that is the sort of skill that you might show tacitly in any sort of Firm Pitch exercise at an AC or VS- they're increasingly common, too.

In terms of the specific examples you use, any example (within reason, obviously) could be used if you felt you could justify it (I tended to ask myself "could I defend this point if I were really cross-examined on it?" to decide this). Just make sure the examples are authentic- remember that they're constantly assessing you as a whole person, so having examples from a wide variety of situations and circumstances is great!

 

[Dheepa]

Hi,

I was wondering how to tackle the question, 'What are your strengths?'. I have been struggling with how broad this is.

I was planning on mentioning thinking outside the box and linking this to an experience of volunteering for a consulting firm and running a glitter tattoo business.

Also, providing tailored service to customers and linking this to my experiences as LexisNexis Student Associate and Open Day ambassador.

However, do these overlap too much and are they worthy strengths to highlight?

Also is two enough or should I highlight three in lesser detail?

I am trying to avoid generic strengths like organisation, communication etc.

Hi Lauren,

Completely agree with what Jacob has already said. Identify skills that trainees should generally have and then work backwards from there thinking about which of those skills you've demonstrated particularly well. However, I actually think your experience in sales through the business and the volunteering at the consulting firm is highly relevant to skills like taking initiative and being entrepreneurial (the latter skill is something I see come up in US firm GR brochures a lot). The providing tailored service examples link very well to being personable and resourceful.

I'd also like to add that I think there's absolutely nothing wrong with what you say are "generic strengths". They're the most foundational things that firms look for in trainees because they really are just that important. So if you feel like you have a particularly strong example demonstrating these (and a question testing them hasn't already been asked), then don't feel like you need to go out of your way to think of completely different skills to show.

 

[IntrepidL]

Hi guys! I was wondering what would be the best way to identify firm-specific challenges/opportunities? I understand that cybersecurity is a huge one in the legal industry and affects all firms, however I am not really sure if it is unique enough to the firm I'm applying for. Thank you for your help!

 

[Jaysen]

Hi guys! I was wondering what would be the best way to identify firm-specific challenges/opportunities? I understand that cybersecurity is a huge one in the legal industry and affects all firms, however I am not really sure if it is unique enough to the firm I'm applying for. Thank you for your help!

You'd want to start with researching the firm first. You can then use the information you find to think about what kind of specific challenges/opportunities the firm may face.

Cybersecurity could definitely be an issue, but you want to think about why that's an issue for the particular firm you are discussing. What measures has the firm put in place for remote working? Has the firm had any cyber issues before? Knowing what you know about the firm, why would cybersecurity be an issue for the firm you have identified?

This will help your response to be more specific to the firm.

 

[Lauren]

Hi Lauren,

Completely agree with what Jacob has already said. Identify skills that trainees should generally have and then work backwards from there thinking about which of those skills you've demonstrated particularly well. However, I actually think your experience in sales through the business and the volunteering at the consulting firm is highly relevant to skills like taking initiative and being entrepreneurial (the latter skill is something I see come up in US firm GR brochures a lot). The providing tailored service examples link very well to being personable and resourceful.

I'd also like to add that I think there's absolutely nothing wrong with what you say are "generic strengths". They're the most foundational things that firms look for in trainees because they really are just that important. So if you feel like you have a particularly strong example demonstrating these (and a question testing them hasn't already been asked), then don't feel like you need to go out of your way to think of completely different skills to show.

Thank you both, very helpful!

 

[Dheepa]

Hi guys! I was wondering what would be the best way to identify firm-specific challenges/opportunities? I understand that cybersecurity is a huge one in the legal industry and affects all firms, however I am not really sure if it is unique enough to the firm I'm applying for. Thank you for your help!

Hi there!

So my personal approach to questions like this has always been to stay away from the general issues facing law firms as a whole. By this I mean things like cybersecurity, data protection, the Big 4, etc. This is because I've always felt like these kind of issues are far too generic and is never tailored enough to the firm.

I always try to work backwards by looking at the a) industries/sectors/regions the firm operates in b) any key clients it might have and what issues they seem to be facing and c) what are the firm's competitors doing

Once you've decided the exact issue you want to focus on, I'd then think about exactly how this creates challenges for the firm: a) Does it affect their work - an uptick/reduction in certain areas b) Does it require new investment - in emerging markets maybe, or making more hires

Then I think you can tie into what kind of opportunities this creates: a) Does the firm have any complementary services it can add to create value or help its clients b) Does the firm have a particular USP/expertise that makes it better suited to capitalise on the challenge rather than its competitors

I hope that gives you some ideas.

 

[IntrepidL]

Thanks @Jaysen and @Dheepa for your responses! Super useful - I think I have a few ideas on what to say now

 

[IntrepidL]

Hi guys! I have been doing some research on various firms, and I have read a few that are hoping to pursue a US merger. I was wondering, how can firms successfully go about achieving this considering that the US is quite a difficult market to break into?

 

[Jessica Booker]

Hi guys! I have been doing some research on various firms, and I have read a few that are hoping to pursue a US merger. I was wondering, how can firms successfully go about achieving this considering that the US is quite a difficult market to break into?

Well I guess that’s the point of the merger - they will be joining with a firm that already has an established market in the US. It’s easier to merge with a firm that has an established brand in the market, rather than try to set up yourself.

 

[Jaysen]

Hi guys! I have been doing some research on various firms, and I have read a few that are hoping to pursue a US merger. I was wondering, how can firms successfully go about achieving this considering that the US is quite a difficult market to break into?

You are right, it is a huge feat for law firms of this size - if you're doing a proper merger, you've got to bring partners on board, prove that there's a compelling case to merge, find a firm with similar profitability levels and attitudes, think about client conflicts etc.

 

[IntrepidL]

Thanks, @Jessica Booker and @Jaysen - in such a situation, I am pre-empting an interview question in which a firm asks, "how can we achieve a US merger?" It's something that a lot of UK firms want to achieve but is difficult to do especially due to different remuneration models/practice area strengths.

 

[Tarnjeet]

Hey guys!

Could someone please help me with this question-

Please outline the reasons why you wish to pursue a career in commercial law at Osborne Clarke. Within your answer you should also include details of how you have developed your skills through your hobbies and interests. (500 words max)*

The questions seems to be asking two things- i)Why OC? and ii)What skills have you developed from your hobbies/interests?
But does my answer to each of these need to be linked- I'm confused that these two have been combined. 'Within your answer' would suggest that your answers needs to be linked (i.e. the skill you have developed from 'x interest/hobby' has led to or has followed from your interest in 'y' which is a reason for why you want to apply to OC)?

If they are linked, then talking about hobbies would be difficult- e.g. one of my hobbies is playing football and the skills I have developed from this are teamwork etc, but can't really link this to 'Why OC'.

Would appreciate anyone's thoughts on this.

 

[Jaysen]

Thanks, @Jessica Booker and @Jaysen - in such a situation, I am pre-empting an interview question in which a firm asks, "how can we achieve a US merger?" It's something that a lot of UK firms want to achieve but is difficult to do especially due to different remuneration models/practice area strengths.

I think it's very unlikely a firm will ask this question unless it's something you state yourself. I know many UK firms want to break further into the US market, but I'm not sure I know that many want a US merger.

 

[Dheepa]

Hey guys!

Could someone please help me with this question-

Please outline the reasons why you wish to pursue a career in commercial law at Osborne Clarke. Within your answer you should also include details of how you have developed your skills through your hobbies and interests. (500 words max)*

The questions seems to be asking two things- i)Why OC? and ii)What skills have you developed from your hobbies/interests?
But does my answer to each of these need to be linked- I'm confused that these two have been combined. 'Within your answer' would suggest that your answers needs to be linked (i.e. the skill you have developed from 'x interest/hobby' has led to or has followed from your interest in 'y' which is a reason for why you want to apply to OC)?

If they are linked, then talking about hobbies would be difficult- e.g. one of my hobbies is playing football and the skills I have developed from this are teamwork etc, but can't really link this to 'Why OC'.

Would appreciate anyone's thoughts on this.

I can see you've already received quite a few replies to this elsewhere on the forum but if it helps I don't think your answers to the skills part need to be linked to why OC. Perhaps it can be linked to why you'd be a good fit for the role of a trainee at OC more generally (maybe look at their website and see what kind of skills exactly they look for in a trainee - this could help make the skills you draw out slightly more specific to OC), but again I think it's perfectly okay to answer the two questions separately.

 

[Naomi U]

Hey guys!

Could someone please help me with this question-

Please outline the reasons why you wish to pursue a career in commercial law at Osborne Clarke. Within your answer you should also include details of how you have developed your skills through your hobbies and interests. (500 words max)*

The questions seems to be asking two things- i)Why OC? and ii)What skills have you developed from your hobbies/interests?
But does my answer to each of these need to be linked- I'm confused that these two have been combined. 'Within your answer' would suggest that your answers needs to be linked (i.e. the skill you have developed from 'x interest/hobby' has led to or has followed from your interest in 'y' which is a reason for why you want to apply to OC)?

If they are linked, then talking about hobbies would be difficult- e.g. one of my hobbies is playing football and the skills I have developed from this are teamwork etc, but can't really link this to 'Why OC'.

Would appreciate anyone's thoughts on this.

Hi Tarnjeet,

I agree with Dheepa, I don't think there has to be direct link to Why OC. Rather, I think I would structure my answer focusing on why OC then talk about my experiences and how they have allowed me to possess the skills needed as an OC trainee.

Best of luck!

 

[Tarnjeet]

@Dheepa @Naomi U

Thanks for the help guys! Have been stuck on this question for ages!

Can I just one more question please- some posts about this question suggest that you would also need to talk about ‘Why commercial law’, but the way I’ve read it the question isn’t asking this.

What’s your views on this?