TCLA Vacation Scheme Applications Discussion Thread 2022-23

[futuretrainee202X]

Is anyone still waiting to hear back from Latham for their open day on 23rd November?

All the thumbs up are very reassuring - thanks all!!

 

[Strawberries]

They only asked for my academic reference and it was for the winter scheme

Hi, what was the turnover time between the interview and your decision?

 

[Jessica Booker]

Hi, just a bit of a grammar q, should 'banking paralegal' be capitalised? And should modules e.g., 'competition law' be capitalised?

This is where it gets a little bit complicated, as it depends on the situation.

To understand when or when not to capitalise a job title, this article is helpful; Capitalization of Job Titles: When Is It Necessary? (yourdictionary.com)

Something like "banking paralegal" would be capitalised if in a heading on a work experience entry, or if you were using it in a signature/sign off, but wouldn't be if you were putting it in a sentence e.g., "I worked as a banking paralegal".

Similarly with module titles, I would expect it to be capitalised if you are adding it as a module result in an application or CV - e.g.,

First-year modules: Contract (60%), Tort (50%), Legal Skills (70%), Land (60%)

But that if you were writing it in a sentence, you wouldn't capitalise it unless it was in a title. For instance:

I enjoyed studying competition law ✅
I won the Competition Law Award in 2022 ✅

I must stress a lot of firms don't stick to these rules though (even in their own application forms). So see how the firm writes job titles like partner, trainee, associate in the body text (e.g. not headings/summaries) and follow their lead.

 

[confusedlawstudent]

I think it may seem like Northern offices have less competition, and it may true in some senses, but given that they generally have fewer places, the competition may end up being proportionally similar. Plus, I'm unsure how well your motivation to apply to a Northern office only to move to London would be looked at as it shows a lack of commitment on your part.

If you do end up applying, I would highlight the practice and deal focuses of the office you're applying to and find the reasons why the cities you've mentioned would be good for your career instead of highlighting your desire to move to London after/during your TC.

That makes sense, thank you!

 

[BM99]

Is anyone still waiting to hear back from Latham for their open day on 23rd November?

Just received PFO for Latham open day

 

[lw2000]

Does anyone know if Fieldfisher are doing a London vac scheme this year? I can only see Birmingham on their website

 

[ssolicitorz]

Can I shorten Baker McKenzie as BM?

 

[malvern3142]

Can I shorten Baker McKenzie as BM?

If you're applying to them directly yes (I work for Baker and we use BM often). However, if you're describing previous experience you've done with them for another application I'd avoid abbreviations.

 

[lik0401]

Can I shorten Baker McKenzie as BM?

I think if the first time you mention it you put 'Baker McKenzie (BM)', then you can - that is what I did for Herbert Smith, e.g. 'Herbert Smith Freehills (HSF)'

 

[Lord Sumption]

Following on from the above discussion how could I abbreviate Slaughter and May or is it not possible?
I can't replace the 'and' with an asterisk as that is how it is spelt and equally using 'Slaughters' looks unprofessional and colloquialized.
Any tips? @Jessica Booker

 

[Lastseasonwonder]

Does anyone know the specific email addresses for A&O grad rec team members? I want to email a specific individual from their grad rec team, but can only find the generic grad rec email address.

 

[NMA]

Just received an invite for the latham open day

Do you know how much they'll reimburse us for travel? Tickets are too expensive

 

[Jessica Booker]

Following on from the above discussion how could I abbreviate Slaughter and May or is it not possible?
I can't replace the 'and' with an asterisk as that is how it is spelt and equally using 'Slaughters' looks unprofessional and colloquialized.
Any tips? @Jessica Booker

It is one of the few firms where I don’t think you should shorten it, unfortunately.

 

[Elsa3.1415]

Hey everyone!
I need help understanding the system for providing academic references to firms.

My situation:
I have done my undergrad in law in Europe and last year an LLM in London. For work references, I have lawyers who have supervised me in short term internships that agreed to be put as reference so it should be all good I hope. But for the academic side, I'd say that is not something that is done too much in my country, and we don't have the equivalent of a supervisor or anything. I don't know any professor personnally. There is one with whom I have one class with a good mark and I wrote my dissertation with him as well and also had a really good mark. However that's about it in terms of relationship, I never even had a meeting or anything. I'm unsure whether he would even agree to be a reference, especially since it has been 3 years now since last contact...
As for my LLM in London, that is the same, no professor could picture my face from my name I believe... We had a personal supervisor (who had ~10 other supervisees) but it was more for general support with studies. In terms of professors, I have 4 modules for which I received distinction, but still don't really see if that is enough of a reason.

Could someone help me understand what firms really expect? Do firm contact them regularily? Even if they are out of the UK? and who would you advise I put as a contact? Does their field of expertise matter? do I need to write to them in advance asking if I am allowed to do that? (I guess that for someone in my country that is for me to find out, but what is the standart for professors in London?) What happens if they get contacted? Is it a call or do they have to provide a full letter? What do they need to attest of? In London, are professors generally willing to say something nice even if they dont really know you? If I were to contact a professor, would I need to tell him/her what grade I had in their module (results are anonymous...)?

Please help me I'm completely lost

Thank you in advance!!

 

[Jessica Booker]

Hey everyone!
I need help understanding the system for providing academic references to firms.

My situation:
I have done my undergrad in law in Europe and last year an LLM in London. For work references, I have lawyers who have supervised me in short term internships that agreed to be put as reference so it should be all good I hope. But for the academic side, I'd say that is not something that is done too much in my country, and we don't have the equivalent of a supervisor or anything. I don't know any professor personnally. There is one with whom I have one class with a good mark and I wrote my dissertation with him as well and also had a really good mark. However that's about it in terms of relationship, I never even had a meeting or anything. I'm unsure whether he would even agree to be a reference, especially since it has been 3 years now since last contact...
As for my LLM in London, that is the same, no professor could picture my face from my name I believe... We had a personal supervisor (who had ~10 other supervisees) but it was more for general support with studies. In terms of professors, I have 4 modules for which I received distinction, but still don't really see if that is enough of a reason.

Could someone help me understand what firms really expect? Do firm contact them regularily? Even if they are out of the UK? and who would you advise I put as a contact? Does their field of expertise matter? do I need to write to them in advance asking if I am allowed to do that? (I guess that for someone in my country that is for me to find out, but what is the standart for professors in London?) What happens if they get contacted? Is it a call or do they have to provide a full letter? What do they need to attest of? In London, are professors generally willing to say something nice even if they dont really know you? If I were to contact a professor, would I need to tell him/her what grade I had in their module (results are anonymous...)?

Please help me I'm completely lost

Thank you in advance!!

A lot of firms are just going to get a factual reference that confirms your dates of education/employment, job title/degree title, and in the case of your academics, confirm your academic results. Any detail beyond this tends to be limited to saying there weren't any conduct or performance issues.

The firm may want more than this, but many organisations do not have the ability to provide anything more than this, and in many cases are unwilling to provide any more detail than this (risk associated with providing subjective details). Many employers will not allow individual employees to give references and instead ask for it to be put through a central team like HR.

The referee will only be contacted until they provide the reference. They may be chased up if they are slow in providing it. If they don't provide it at all, the law firm/reference check company will come back to you and ask you to provide alternative details.

It really doesn't matter who they are.

Out of politeness, in situations you are asking individuals (rather than organisations) to provide a reference, you should be asking them whether it is ok for you to pass on their contact details. It is a good way to also give them a heads-up to expect the reference request coming through.

It tends to be a written reference rather than a call.

Any academic referee still at the university will have access to your academic results, so you don't need to tell them what they are.

 

[Elsa3.1415]

A lot of firms are just going to get a factual reference that confirms your dates of education/employment, job title/degree title, and in the case of your academics, confirm your academic results. Any detail beyond this tends to be limited to saying there weren't any conduct or performance issues.

The firm may want more than this, but many organisations do not have the ability to provide anything more than this, and in many cases are unwilling to provide any more detail than this (risk associated with providing subjective details). Many employers will not allow individual employees to give references and instead ask for it to be put through a central team like HR.

The referee will only be contacted until they provide the reference. They may be chased up if they are slow in providing it. If they don't provide it at all, the law firm/reference check company will come back to you and ask you to provide alternative details.

It really doesn't matter who they are.

Out of politeness, in situations you are asking individuals (rather than organisations) to provide a reference, you should be asking them whether it is ok for you to pass on their contact details. It is a good way to also give them a heads-up to expect the reference request coming through.

It tends to be a written reference rather than a call.

Any academic referee still at the university will have access to your academic results, so you don't need to tell them what they are.

Thank you very much for your prompt response Jessica!

If I understand well, for the academic side, firms want a contact that will be able to confirm the factual details I provide? Does that mean I should provide detail of the student administration, who has access to all the records? Should I provide one for each University I have been educated at?

 

[Jessica Booker]

Thank you very much for your prompt response Jessica!

If I understand well, for the academic side, firms want a contact that will be able to confirm the factual details I provide? Does that mean I should provide detail of the student administration, who has access to all the records? Should I provide one for each University I have been educated at?

The firm may want more than just confirmation of your grades, but many universities will only confirm your grades. Many cannot provide the detail that firms request - and the firms accept that. You should provide the contact for the university that you feel is most appropriate given your circumstances.

Whether you provide multiple points of contact across universities is dependent on what the firm is requesting. Some only request one academic reference.

 

[starman]

Hi @Jessica Booker - I have one hypothetical question. If a person is offered 2 vacation schemes that conflict with one another, are law firms ever flexible with deferring an offer/moving one's VS to another season (ie Winter->Summer) - how would one approach this matter, simultaneously willing to show Firm B that they care a lot about the scheme despite not choosing it right now?

Thank you!

 

[Donuttime]

Any updates from White & Case?

 

[AvniD]

Hi - anyone got any advice on applying to WFW? I am stuck on this question.

'You are a trainee solicitor, working in the office and it is 6.30pm. You have an important personal appointment at 7pm. You are updating a document ready for a client meeting which will take place at 10am the next day. As this is a new client it is important that the firm impresses them and accuracy is key. You are waiting on some information from a third party before you can finalise the document. You have also received several emails from other fee-earners in the department asking you to help them on some urgent tasks. Your supervisor is working from home. What do you do?'

Thanks

I would break this question down into it's many parts before proceeding to answer. So the concerns are-

• You have an important personal appointment in half an hour
• The meeting with the important client is the next day at 10 am
• Other fee-earners in the department need your help for urgent tasks
• Supervisor is working from home

The core task at hand is managing time while supporting your team and making time for yourself as well. For me, the key in any situation where there are conflicting priorities is to reshuffle my calendar and communicate my capacity with my team. Based on this there are various way in which you can approach this scenario.

The first person I'd contact is your supervisor telling them about your personal appointment and that you are waiting on Info from a third party before you finalise the client doc. You could also ask your supervisor for advice on how you can support the other fee earners while focusing on your client doc and not cancelling/rescheduling your personal appointment.

You could also speak to the fee earners directly and clarify if any of the work they've asked for your support on can wait until the next day when the meeting with the important client is over. You could also see if you can complete any of these tasks while you wait for info from the third party.

There are so many way in which you can approach your answer but as long as you focus on clear communication, supporting your team and re-prioritising your calendar, you should have a strong answer on your hands!