On working in the US

[yuk0n]

Hi everyone. I must preface this by stating that I am new to this forum, so I’m not certain that this has been posted in the right place. Do let me know if so.

To give context to my situation, I’m due to start my law degree this autumn. Whilst I am of course keeping my options relatively open, I’ve found that through commercial awareness seminars, my own wider reading and personal research that I am likely to go down the commercial route (most likely as a solicitor, but again we’ll see). I am particularly interested in working at a US firm as I’ve been keeping up with a decent handful of firms’ activity and have been particularly impressed by what some of the US firms have been up to.

Of course, I’m not putting all of my eggs in one basket, and although I am sitting on an unconditional to study at Oxbridge & am doing everything I can to bolster my CV and prepare myself for my studies to get the best marks I can, I understand that a US firm training contract won’t come easy. With that out the way, if I am able to secure work at one of these firms’ London office, how likely is it that I might get to work in America one day? I am especially interested in New York’s legal market, as I not only like the idea of staying there, but also love the corporate work that occurs there. Not to mention the fact that I have heard that you don’t need to undergo a JD to practise there.

I am of conscious of the fact that this will depend heavily on the individual firm. With that in mind, I would appreciate any viewpoints on particular US firms’ attitude to this.

Thank you in advance

 

[Jessica Booker]

Hi everyone. I must preface this by stating that I am new to this forum, so I’m not certain that this has been posted in the right place. Do let me know if so.

To give context to my situation, I’m due to start my law degree this autumn. Whilst I am of course keeping my options relatively open, I’ve found that through commercial awareness seminars, my own wider reading and personal research that I am likely to go down the commercial route (most likely as a solicitor, but again we’ll see). I am particularly interested in working at a US firm as I’ve been keeping up with a decent handful of firms’ activity and have been particularly impressed by what some of the US firms have been up to.

Of course, I’m not putting all of my eggs in one basket, and although I am sitting on an unconditional to study at Oxbridge & am doing everything I can to bolster my CV and prepare myself for my studies to get the best marks I can, I understand that a US firm training contract won’t come easy. With that out the way, if I am able to secure work at one of these firms’ London office, how likely is it that I might get to work in America one day? I am especially interested in New York’s legal market, as I not only like the idea of staying there, but also love the corporate work that occurs there. Not to mention the fact that I have heard that you don’t need to undergo a JD to practise there.

I am of conscious of the fact that this will depend heavily on the individual firm. With that in mind, I would appreciate any viewpoints on particular US firms’ attitude to this.

Thank you in advance

You don’t need a JD, but most people you will be up against job entry level legal jobs will have one. So if you don’t, your CV is going to need to be exceptional elsewhere, and will probably still need a US LLM.

The issue with working in the US is mainly visas though. Getting a visa isn’t straight forward nor necessarily easy, and this may restrict your ability to work in the US more than anything else.

The way around these factors is usually to transfer from one office with a firm to the US office. It does happen - whether it be a secondment (eg a fixed period of time of 6 months or more) or a permanent move. However, these opportunities don’t happen a lot. Out of an office of 1,000 lawyers, only a very small number will move to the US each year, and by very small I mean you’ll be able to count on one hand. And you’ll be working in an environment where you’re unlikely to be the strongest contender for that opportunity.

You ultimately will have to engineer your career to get as much exposure to US clients or UK/US matters. You’ll also need to ensure you think about which seats you did during your training contract carefully. Finally, you’ll need a fair bit of good fortune.

So it is all possible, but not easy nor straight forward and will require a lot of hard work to get there.

 

[Daniel Boden]

You don’t need a JD, but most people you will be up against job entry level legal jobs will have one. So if you don’t, your CV is going to need to be exceptional elsewhere, and will probably still need a US LLM.

The issue with working in the US is mainly visas though. Getting a visa isn’t straight forward nor necessarily easy, and this may restrict your ability to work in the US more than anything else.

The way around these factors is usually to transfer from one office with a firm to the US office. It does happen - whether it be a secondment (eg a fixed period of time of 6 months or more) or a permanent move. However, these opportunities don’t happen a lot. Out of an office of 1,000 lawyers, only a very small number will move to the US each year, and by very small I mean you’ll be able to count on one hand. And you’ll be working in an environment where you’re unlikely to be the strongest contender for that opportunity.

You ultimately will have to engineer your career to get as much exposure to US clients or UK/US matters. You’ll also need to ensure you think about which seats you did during your training contract carefully. Finally, you’ll need a fair bit of good fortune.

So it is all possible, but not easy nor straight forward and will require a lot of hard work to get there.

Hi everyone. I must preface this by stating that I am new to this forum, so I’m not certain that this has been posted in the right place. Do let me know if so.

To give context to my situation, I’m due to start my law degree this autumn. Whilst I am of course keeping my options relatively open, I’ve found that through commercial awareness seminars, my own wider reading and personal research that I am likely to go down the commercial route (most likely as a solicitor, but again we’ll see). I am particularly interested in working at a US firm as I’ve been keeping up with a decent handful of firms’ activity and have been particularly impressed by what some of the US firms have been up to.

Of course, I’m not putting all of my eggs in one basket, and although I am sitting on an unconditional to study at Oxbridge & am doing everything I can to bolster my CV and prepare myself for my studies to get the best marks I can, I understand that a US firm training contract won’t come easy. With that out the way, if I am able to secure work at one of these firms’ London office, how likely is it that I might get to work in America one day? I am especially interested in New York’s legal market, as I not only like the idea of staying there, but also love the corporate work that occurs there. Not to mention the fact that I have heard that you don’t need to undergo a JD to practise there.

I am of conscious of the fact that this will depend heavily on the individual firm. With that in mind, I would appreciate any viewpoints on particular US firms’ attitude to this.

Thank you in advance

Yeah, to practice in New York you need a US LLM to be eligible to take the NY Bar or have a 3-year law degree. If you're a non-law student and do the GDL then you need to do a US LLM which obviously can be very expensive!

Alternatively, once you've qualified as a solicitor in the UK you are eligible to sit the California bar exam which is also a huge legal market in the US but obviously, it would depend on how much time you'd have to study to sit it and then indeed pass it as these bar exams are by no means easy at all...

 

[Adam Gilchrist]

The other option (expensive and time-consuming) is applying to American law schools after completing your undergrad degree here. You need money (or a scholarship) and amazing grades (don't even bother if it's an offer from a law school outside the top 14, no hope in hell that a US firm will sponsor you for a visa otherwise).

I know a couple of people who ended up practicing in the USA that way - they went to Harvard/Yale/Stanford law school, then got sponsored for a visa by the firms in question.

Naturally, that's far less likely than the advice/guidance other people in this thread have given you, but it is still a path to practicing in the USA that I know people personally who have taken.

 

[Daniel Boden]

Hi you might find what LM (corporate associate at global firm) helpful.


L&W have sent some NQs over to their California office in the past. I actually don't know any other US firm in London that has done this and either way when speaking to some associates at the firm, it's not an easy move to make. If you'd really like more clarity on this, I'd suggest reaching out to some of these people that have moved over via Linkedin.

Gibson Dunn has also done it before I believe but yeah as @Dheepa says it's pretty rare and a challenging move especially due to the difficulty of studying and passing the bar exam whilst working full-time in a US corporate law firm as I mentioned above

 

[yuk0n]

You don’t need a JD, but most people you will be up against job entry level legal jobs will have one. So if you don’t, your CV is going to need to be exceptional elsewhere, and will probably still need a US LLM.

The issue with working in the US is mainly visas though. Getting a visa isn’t straight forward nor necessarily easy, and this may restrict your ability to work in the US more than anything else.

The way around these factors is usually to transfer from one office with a firm to the US office. It does happen - whether it be a secondment (eg a fixed period of time of 6 months or more) or a permanent move. However, these opportunities don’t happen a lot. Out of an office of 1,000 lawyers, only a very small number will move to the US each year, and by very small I mean you’ll be able to count on one hand. And you’ll be working in an environment where you’re unlikely to be the strongest contender for that opportunity.

You ultimately will have to engineer your career to get as much exposure to US clients or UK/US matters. You’ll also need to ensure you think about which seats you did during your training contract carefully. Finally, you’ll need a fair bit of good fortune.

So it is all possible, but not easy nor straight forward and will require a lot of hard work to get there.

Hello Jessica (if I may), thank you for your response.

I'm definitely thinking of perhaps trying to engineer my career towards US matters (I tend to be a bit more interested in these affairs regardless). Supposing I am lucky enough to perhaps get a secondment/move, how long do you think this might typically take?

I'm particularly interested in your comment about training contract seats. How do you think I should approach this?

Thanks again for the response.

 

[Jessica Booker]

Hello Jessica (if I may), thank you for your response.

I'm definitely thinking of perhaps trying to engineer my career towards US matters (I tend to be a bit more interested in these affairs regardless). Supposing I am lucky enough to perhaps get a secondment/move, how long do you think this might typically take?

I'm particularly interested in your comment about training contract seats. How do you think I should approach this?

Thanks again for the response.

Some firms do six month secondments as a trainee, but you’ll ultimately return as a NQ to the London office.

Realistically, a long term secondment or permanent move most likely will happen sometime after 3 years PQE.

The seats you do as a trainee will need to reflect the type of work you would do in the US or have more US related work. That will obviously vary by firm. Best way to get what you want is to work your backside off and impress people.

 

[yuk0n]

Yeah, to practice in New York you need a US LLM to be eligible to take the NY Bar or have a 3-year law degree. If you're a non-law student and do the GDL then you need to do a US LLM which obviously can be very expensive!

Alternatively, once you've qualified as a solicitor in the UK you are eligible to sit the California bar exam which is also a huge legal market in the US but obviously, it would depend on how much time you'd have to study to sit it and then indeed pass it as these bar exams are by no means easy at all...

Hi Daniel (if it's okay),

I will be doing a 3 year law degree in the UK. Does this mean I won't have to undergo a US LLM to take the NY bar?

Would I be allowed to sit the California bar exam (and subsequently begin practice in California) without any additional qualifications, assuming I have qualified as a solicitor? It's something I'd have to think more carefully about as I have heard that the California bar exam is notoriously difficult, and I'd probably have to put in quite a bit of time to ensure I pass. I am definitely interested though, especially given that there are some seriously fascinating developments regarding startups in places like Silicon Valley and also the corporate presence in significant CA cities such as LA.

Thank you for your response!

 

[yuk0n]

Hi you might find what LM (corporate associate at global firm) helpful.


L&W have sent some NQs over to their California office in the past. I actually don't know any other US firm in London that has done this and either way when speaking to some associates at the firm, it's not an easy move to make. If you'd really like more clarity on this, I'd suggest reaching out to some of these people that have moved over via Linkedin.

I am definitely interested in L&W, so this is really helpful information. I'll have a look on LinkedIn now, thank you!

 

[yuk0n]

The other option (expensive and time-consuming) is applying to American law schools after completing your undergrad degree here. You need money (or a scholarship) and amazing grades (don't even bother if it's an offer from a law school outside the top 14, no hope in hell that a US firm will sponsor you for a visa otherwise).

I know a couple of people who ended up practicing in the USA that way - they went to Harvard/Yale/Stanford law school, then got sponsored for a visa by the firms in question.

Naturally, that's far less likely than the advice/guidance other people in this thread have given you, but it is still a path to practicing in the USA that I know people personally who have taken.

Hi Adam (if I may), thank you for the response

I've been thinking about applying to high end American law schools e.g. Ivy Leagues and similar institutions (such as Stanford) but I'm not sure I'll end up doing it because, as you mentioned, it's long-winded and expensive. I'll probably have a bigger think about it if it turns out that I really want a great chance of going to the US (my understanding is that going to a US law school, whilst expensive and time-consuming, would carry a bit more certainty in securing a spot in the US market provided I do get a place at a top 14).

Thanks again!

 

[Daniel Boden]

Hi Daniel (if it's okay),

I will be doing a 3 year law degree in the UK. Does this mean I won't have to undergo a US LLM to take the NY bar?

Would I be allowed to sit the California bar exam (and subsequently begin practice in California) without any additional qualifications, assuming I have qualified as a solicitor? It's something I'd have to think more carefully about as I have heard that the California bar exam is notoriously difficult, and I'd probably have to put in quite a bit of time to ensure I pass. I am definitely interested though, especially given that there are some seriously fascinating developments regarding startups in places like Silicon Valley and also the corporate presence in significant CA cities such as LA.

Thank you for your response!

1. Yes you won't need a US LLM to be eligible to sit the NY bar exam if you have a 3 year LLB. This link outlines it: https://www.nybarexam.org/Rules/Rules.htm#520.6

2. Yes once you are qualified as a solicitor in the UK you are eligible to sit the California bar exam: http://www.calbar.ca.gov/Admissions/Requirements/Education/Legal-Education/Foreign-Education

 

[yuk0n]

1. Yes you won't need a US LLM to be eligible to sit the NY bar exam if you have a 3 year LLB. This link outlines it: https://www.nybarexam.org/Rules/Rules.htm#520.6

2. Yes once you are qualified as a solicitor in the UK you are eligible to sit the California bar exam: http://www.calbar.ca.gov/Admissions/Requirements/Education/Legal-Education/Foreign-Education

Thanks a lot Daniel!
Just to double check, a BA degree as opposed to an LLB would be fine, right?

 

[Jessica Booker]

Thanks a lot Daniel!
Just to double check, a BA degree as opposed to an LLB would be fine, right?

As long as it is at least three years and a qualifying law degree, yes.

 

[Daniel Boden]

Thanks a lot Daniel!
Just to double check, a BA degree as opposed to an LLB would be fine, right?

I'm not sure it would because I don't think a BA is usually a qualifying law degree whereas the LLB is? Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong but I believe that's what my LLB mates have said in the past - @Jessica Booker could you confirm?

 

[Jessica Booker]

I'm not sure it would because I don't think a BA is usually a qualifying law degree whereas the LLB is? Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong but I believe that's what my LLB mates have said in the past - @Jessica Booker could you confirm?

There are BA degrees that are qualifying law degrees. Oxford is the one that comes up the most.

 

[yuk0n]

There are BA degrees that are qualifying law degrees. Oxford is the one that comes up the most.

Sorry for late response! Cambridge’s (my university) degree is qualifying I’m pretty sure, so I’m guessing that’s all good? Not to speak for all BAs of course

 

[Daniel Boden]

Sorry for late response! Cambridge’s (my university) degree is qualifying I’m pretty sure, so I’m guessing that’s all good? Not to speak for all BAs of course

Yeah in that case, as it's a 3-year qualifying law degree, you'd be fine