How difficult is it to get a VS being mid 20s and already qualified in another country?

[ninadeoliveira]

Hiya!

I'm Nina and I'm a foreign qualified lawyer starting an LLM at UCL this September (self funded) and I've been looking at training contracts and vacation schemes. I graduated in 2019 in my home country, completed a training contract and qualified there, but now that I've decided to up and move to London, I'm having to do it all over again. I know that in order to be employable here in the UK I need the experience only a training contract can give me. I've also talked to some friends in the field and they all agree TC is the best option for me.

But I need to realistically know if it is even possible to secure a vacation scheme at my old age of 25

For example, I was looking at a law firm page and it said this:

Who is eligible to apply for a vacation scheme?  Students and graduates from any discipline are welcome to apply for our vacation scheme, as long as you’re in your penultimate year of study.

I am definitely not in my penultimate year of study, so they probably wouldn't even consider me, right? Have any of you guys gone through something similar? Any advice for me? I'm kinda lost and overwhelmed right now.

Thank you for hearing me out! 💕

 

[OB]

Hiya!

I'm Nina and I'm a foreign qualified lawyer starting an LLM at UCL this September (self funded) and I've been looking at training contracts and vacation schemes. I graduated in 2019 in my home country, completed a training contract and qualified there, but now that I've decided to up and move to London, I'm having to do it all over again. I know that in order to be employable here in the UK I need the experience only a training contract can give me. I've also talked to some friends in the field and they all agree TC is the best option for me.

But I need to realistically know if it is even possible to secure a vacation scheme at my old age of 25

For example, I was looking at a law firm page and it said this:

Who is eligible to apply for a vacation scheme?  Students and graduates from any discipline are welcome to apply for our vacation scheme, as long as you’re in your penultimate year of study.

I am definitely not in my penultimate year of study, so they probably wouldn't even consider me, right? Have any of you guys gone through something similar? Any advice for me? I'm kinda lost and overwhelmed right now.

Thank you for hearing me out! 💕

If you're qualified in your home country, you could work here as a qualified solicitor in your home country I believe? At work I have many solicitors with (Admitted in ___) in their email signatures. And you could look to qualify in England & Wales through taking the SQE1 exam and potentially being exempt from SQE2 depending on which country you're qualified in?

 

[Jessica Booker]

Hiya!

I'm Nina and I'm a foreign qualified lawyer starting an LLM at UCL this September (self funded) and I've been looking at training contracts and vacation schemes. I graduated in 2019 in my home country, completed a training contract and qualified there, but now that I've decided to up and move to London, I'm having to do it all over again. I know that in order to be employable here in the UK I need the experience only a training contract can give me. I've also talked to some friends in the field and they all agree TC is the best option for me.

But I need to realistically know if it is even possible to secure a vacation scheme at my old age of 25

For example, I was looking at a law firm page and it said this:

Who is eligible to apply for a vacation scheme?  Students and graduates from any discipline are welcome to apply for our vacation scheme, as long as you’re in your penultimate year of study.

I am definitely not in my penultimate year of study, so they probably wouldn't even consider me, right? Have any of you guys gone through something similar? Any advice for me? I'm kinda lost and overwhelmed right now.

Thank you for hearing me out! 💕

Your age is not an issue here at all - average age of a trainee is 28, and if you said vacation scheme students are recruited three years in advance, that puts you right at the average.

And that is actually your biggest challenge. Firms typically recruit trainees 2-3 years in advance, and use their vacation schemes as a pipeline of talent for training contracts. The 2-3 years is done because historically this time was needed for undergraduate students to complete their degrees and then start law school before starting their TC. You don’t need to study, and so you have 2-3 years where you can work. In that 2-3 years, especially given you could sit the SQE and become a qualified lawyer in that time, you couldn’t need to do a training contract. And because of that, firms are less likely to offer you a vacation scheme spot, because they will want to save it for those who can do a TC.

 

[ninadeoliveira]

Your age is not an issue here at all - average age of a trainee is 28, and if you said vacation scheme students are recruited three years in advance, that puts you right at the average.

And that is actually your biggest challenge. Firms typically recruit trainees 2-3 years in advance, and use their vacation schemes as a pipeline of talent for training contracts. The 2-3 years is done because historically this time was needed for undergraduate students to complete their degrees and then start law school before starting their TC. You don’t need to study, and so you have 2-3 years where you can work. In that 2-3 years, especially given you could sit the SQE and become a qualified lawyer in that time, you couldn’t need to do a training contract. And because of that, firms are less likely to offer you a vacation scheme spot, because they will want to save it for those who can do a TC.

Thank you so much for you reply, Jessica! That really clears things up on my mind.

I was thinking of applying to training contracts that start in 2025, and I'll be studying for 10 months from this September. After the LLM I was thinking about doing paralegal work for (give or take) a year until the training contract started, not sitting the SQEs. Maybe I could just explain that on my application? I'm not quite sure what to do because I really want to secure a VS or training contract.

Again, thank you so much for helping me out!

 

[ninadeoliveira]

If you're qualified in your home country, you could work here as a qualified solicitor in your home country I believe? At work I have many solicitors with (Admitted in ___) in their email signatures. And you could look to qualify in England & Wales through taking the SQE1 exam and potentially being exempt from SQE2 depending on which country you're qualified in?

Hey, thank you for replying!

Yes, I've looked into that! I could try working here as a qualified solicitor in my home country, but that wouldn't really give me the work experience I'm looking for (getting to know the areas of English law and deciding which one is right for me) like a TC would.

And I reckon that if I just went ahead and sat the SQEs and became a solicitor in the UK I'd still be borderline unemployable with no UK experience, you know? I'm not sure, I'm so new to all this.

Thank you again for helping me out!

 

[crispychicken]

I did my first vac sheme when I was 25, and did my second when I was 26. So it is definitely possible to secure a vac scheme at the old age of 25. Do be prepared that you are very likely to be the oldest vac schemer in your cohort though.

 

[Jessica Booker]

Thank you so much for you reply, Jessica! That really clears things up on my mind.

I was thinking of applying to training contracts that start in 2025, and I'll be studying for 10 months from this September. After the LLM I was thinking about doing paralegal work for (give or take) a year until the training contract started, not sitting the SQEs. Maybe I could just explain that on my application? I'm not quite sure what to do because I really want to secure a VS or training contract.

Again, thank you so much for helping me out!

Many firms will expect you to sit the SQE before the training contract, so you will need to factor that into the timing.

The other challenge you have is that when you pass the SQE you be a qualified lawyer in England and Wales, as foreign qualified lawyers don’t have to accumulate qualifying work experience.

You’ll need to invest time speaking directly to the firms to see what their advice is about what they recommend you apply to as different firms will have different approaches to this dilemma.

 

[RANDOTRON]

Hi @ninadeoliveira, hope I'm not too late to this but I have met career changers who started their training contract in their 30s. I have friends who got their TC offer in their mid-to-late 20s, so age is definitely not an issue for getting vacation schemes and training contracts.

If you already have legal experience, I'd recommend just applying for a direct TC, rather than going for the vacation scheme. That said, you can still apply for the vacation scheme route if you want – I have a friend who did vacation schemes during their LLM. You can even do a mixture of both – some firms you apply for vacation schemes, others you apply for a direct TC. Just to note that most firms will only allow one application (either VS or direct TC) per application cycle. So quick edit here to recommend you to apply in this 2022/2023 cycle since it's coming to a close in the next month or two anyways, you may as well apply. If you're not successful this cycle, the next cycle starts literally in the next two to three month.

In any case, as @Jessica Booker said, firms typically recruit 2 years ahead, so this is how it could play out for you (I am generalising here – when you get your TC, the firm you're with will tell you what to do):

1. For a TC to commence in 2025, you'll need to secure one before this current 2022/2023 application cycle ends (which will end in July/August). Assuming you get one this cycle, you will go on to complete your LLM in 2024, start your SQE right after and finish in 2025, whereupon you will begin your TC.
2. If you apply during your LLM (like some of my friends did), you will be applying in the upcoming 2023/2024 cycle (ie, for TC commencing in 2026). Assuming you get one in this cycle, you will finish your LLM in 2024, have a one-year break between 2024 and 2025, start your SQE in 2025 which you'll finish in 2026 and begin your TC then.
3. If you apply after finish your LLM (like I did), you will be applying in the 2024/2025 cycle for TC commencing in 2027. Assuming you get one this cycle, that means you will get a one-year break between 2025 and 2026, do your SQE in 2026, finishing in 2027, then starting your TC. Of course, if you secure a TC early on in the 2024/2025 cycle (like in January or March), then you'll have a break starting from then to your SQE start date in 2026.

You can spend your one-year break in scenario 2 and 3 doing paralegal work if you want to – its really different strokes for different folks (eg, my friends wanted to do paralegal work, I wanted to go home). To my knowledge, you don't need to mention what you intend to do for your year of break in your VS/TC application. Depending on availability and the firm's policy on this, they may let you start your SQE course or TC earlier.

Hope this helps!

 

[ninadeoliveira]

Hi @ninadeoliveira, hope I'm not too late to this but I have met career changers who started their training contract in their 30s. I have friends who got their TC offer in their mid-to-late 20s, so age is definitely not an issue for getting vacation schemes and training contracts.

If you already have legal experience, I'd recommend just applying for a direct TC, rather than going for the vacation scheme. That said, you can still apply for the vacation scheme route if you want – I have a friend who did vacation schemes during their LLM. You can even do a mixture of both – some firms you apply for vacation schemes, others you apply for a direct TC. Just to note that most firms will only allow one application (either VS or direct TC) per application cycle. So quick edit here to recommend you to apply in this 2022/2023 cycle since it's coming to a close in the next month or two anyways, you may as well apply. If you're not successful this cycle, the next cycle starts literally in the next two to three month.

In any case, as @Jessica Booker said, firms typically recruit 2 years ahead, so this is how it could play out for you (I am generalising here – when you get your TC, the firm you're with will tell you what to do):

1. For a TC to commence in 2025, you'll need to secure one before this current 2022/2023 application cycle ends (which will end in July/August). Assuming you get one this cycle, you will go on to complete your LLM in 2024, start your SQE right after and finish in 2025, whereupon you will begin your TC.
2. If you apply during your LLM (like some of my friends did), you will be applying in the upcoming 2023/2024 cycle (ie, for TC commencing in 2026). Assuming you get one in this cycle, you will finish your LLM in 2024, have a one-year break between 2024 and 2025, start your SQE in 2025 which you'll finish in 2026 and begin your TC then.
3. If you apply after finish your LLM (like I did), you will be applying in the 2024/2025 cycle for TC commencing in 2027. Assuming you get one this cycle, that means you will get a one-year break between 2025 and 2026, do your SQE in 2026, finishing in 2027, then starting your TC. Of course, if you secure a TC early on in the 2024/2025 cycle (like in January or March), then you'll have a break starting from then to your SQE start date in 2026.

You can spend your one-year break in scenario 2 and 3 doing paralegal work if you want to – its really different strokes for different folks (eg, my friends wanted to do paralegal work, I wanted to go home). To my knowledge, you don't need to mention what you intend to do for your year of break in your VS/TC application. Depending on availability and the firm's policy on this, they may let you start your SQE course or TC earlier.

Hope this helps!

Wow, thank you so much for the advice and insight on training contracts and vacation schemes. It really cleared things up for me! I seriously appreciate you taking the time to help me out. Thanks again!

 

[Sim96]

Many firms will expect you to sit the SQE before the training contract, so you will need to factor that into the timing.

The other challenge you have is that when you pass the SQE you be a qualified lawyer in England and Wales, as foreign qualified lawyers don’t have to accumulate qualifying work experience.

You’ll need to invest time speaking directly to the firms to see what their advice is about what they recommend you apply to as different firms will have different approaches to this dilemma.

I would be grateful for your advice, without disturbing your busy schedule - sorry facing issues on double posting (due to technical difficulties)

Q1. What type of law firms and in which location (generally) would be open to receiving Training Contract applications from qualified lawyers? (I qualified in India 3 years ago, and in England 1 year ago)? Is it a good idea to apply? I am very keen on training.
Q2. I have been an Associate for 3 years. In my work experience section for training contracts - should I set out the designation as "Lawyer" instead of Associate? I will not mention my England and Wales qualification
Q3. Is it Ok to also apply for Vacs scheme?
Q4. I am on 1 month notice with my current firm. Is it better to apply from employment? Thanks so much.

 

[Jessica Booker]

I would be grateful for your advice, without disturbing your busy schedule - sorry facing issues on double posting (due to technical difficulties)

Q1. What type of law firms and in which location (generally) would be open to receiving Training Contract applications from qualified lawyers? (I qualified in India 3 years ago, and in England 1 year ago)? Is it a good idea to apply? I am very keen on training.
Q2. I have been an Associate for 3 years. In my work experience section for training contracts - should I set out the designation as "Lawyer" instead of Associate? I will not mention my England and Wales qualification
Q3. Is it Ok to also apply for Vacs scheme?
Q4. I am on 1 month notice with my current firm. Is it better to apply from employment? Thanks so much.

One quick question - have you got the right to work in the U.K. for a vacation scheme?