Ask A Graduate Recruiter Anything!

[futuretraineesolicitor]

Thanks to all.

 

[Dennis Varghese]

Hi Jessica - a quick question.

Is it a good option to qualify for the NY Bar while still applying for TC's? Dubai is considered quite multi jurisdictional and lawyers from all sorts of background practice here. But how do firms in general react if they discover a potential TC candidate has also applied for the NY Bar? I can explain my reasons for qualifying but would it put me at a disadvantage?

thanks.

 

[Jessica Booker]

Hi Jessica - a quick question.

Is it a good option to qualify for the NY Bar while still applying for TC's? Dubai is considered quite multi jurisdictional and lawyers from all sorts of background practice here. But how do firms in general react if they discover a potential TC candidate has also applied for the NY Bar? I can explain my reasons for qualifying but would it put me at a disadvantage?

thanks.

it’s not something to do to improve your TC chances, It is only something to do for your longer career aspirations. It may help a little with secondments/moves to the US or somewhere like Dubai, but ultimately if you pass the NYB and then do an English TC, your experience will be in English law and not having consistent US law experience will limit what you can do.

The disadvantage is that if you choose to qualify elsewhere, a TC technically isn’t a necessity. All the investment (GDL/LPC/PSC/two year contract, three areas of law etc) isn’t required and so a firm can question what’s the point of putting you through all that. However, currently you would need to complete the QLTS to be able to work instead.

The SQE will change this though as a qualified lawyer from another jurisdiction would also need to take the SQE and gain 2 years experience. So the attitudes to taking on qualified lawyers from other jurisdictions but with little/no experience, may be very different, especially with work permit processes becoming a lot easier as of the end of this year.

 

[futuretraineesolicitor]

@Jessica Booker Ma'am, what is the best way to show our genuine interest in a practise area- what should we mention- I mean work experience/activities etc which backs our inclination towards a particular area- which shows that our interest is not just on the surface- we know it well and it has developed

 

[Jessica Booker]

@Jessica Booker Ma'am, what is the best way to show our genuine interest in a practise area- what should we mention- I mean work experience/activities etc which backs our inclination towards a particular area- which shows that our interest is not just on the surface- we know it well and it has developed

It doesn’t matter where you interest comes from or how you have gained it. There isn’t one best way to these things apart from using your individual motivation, logic, reasoning and evidence.

 

[futuretraineesolicitor]

Thank You Ma'am.

 

[futuretraineesolicitor]

What do men wear at Summer Vacation schemes? Proper suits or just shirts ties and trousers without the blazers. Before anyone pounces on me, yes I know we first have to make it to the VS to think about what we are going to wear but since I am from India and I will be doing internships in my home country also, I might as well buy clothes now because the sale is on! @Jessica Booker @Daniel Boden
Also, even during socials we have to come dressed in formals? Or do we need casuals for events?
I know this might sound very ambitious of me right now but please bear with me everyone

 

[Daniel Boden]

What do men wear at Summer Vacation schemes? Proper suits or just shirts ties and trousers without the blazers. Before anyone pounces on me, yes I know we first have to make it to the VS to think about what we are going to wear but since I am from India and I will be doing internships in my home country also, I might as well buy clothes now because the sale is on! @Jessica Booker @Daniel Boden
Also, even during socials we have to come dressed in formals? Or do we need casuals for events?
I know this might sound very ambitious of me right now but please bear with me everyone

I'm not sure what the form is in your home country but in England we tend to wear suits. I always bring a tie with me and wear it for assessments and any interviews, but most of the time for the day-to-day work at the office wearing a tie is not necessary at least in my experience at US firms. MC or SC firms may be different but what is for certain is that you wear a suit even for socials but if the event is more active e.g. softball or something then you may bring a change of clothes with you

 

[Alice G]

I'm not sure what the form is in your home country but in England we tend to wear suits. I always bring a tie with me and wear it for assessments and any interviews, but most of the time for the day-to-day work at the office wearing a tie is not necessary at least in my experience at US firms. MC or SC firms may be different but what is for certain is that you wear a suit even for socials but if the event is more active e.g. softball or something then you may bring a change of clothes with you

Agreed Dan, I’d always have a tie handy just in case you’re asked to a meeting or to Court

 

[futuretraineesolicitor]

Thanks guys, shopping time.

 

[Jessica Booker]

What do men wear at Summer Vacation schemes? Proper suits or just shirts ties and trousers without the blazers. Before anyone pounces on me, yes I know we first have to make it to the VS to think about what we are going to wear but since I am from India and I will be doing internships in my home country also, I might as well buy clothes now because the sale is on! @Jessica Booker @Daniel Boden
Also, even during socials we have to come dressed in formals? Or do we need casuals for events?
I know this might sound very ambitious of me right now but please bear with me everyone

Typically full suit. Some firms operate more dress down policies where a collared shirt and chinos you could get away with if you didn’t have any client meetings. Most lawyers who work like this have a smart suit In the office should there be any last minute client meetings though.

Socials are different - people typically will bring a change of clothes for these or will find a way of dressing down what they have worn to the office that day at least.

 

[futuretraineesolicitor]

Hello @Jessica Booker , I was looking at Bird & Bird's profile on Legal Cheek, the website had this pie chart which showed what % of associates are from Russel Groups, Non Russel Groups and International. The 'International' slice in the pie chart was at 0% - Does that mean I will be wasting my time if I decide to apply there?

 

[Jessica Booker]

Hello @Jessica Booker , I was looking at Bird & Bird's profile on Legal Cheek, the website had this pie chart which showed what % of associates are from Russel Groups, Non Russel Groups and International. The 'International' slice in the pie chart was at 0% - Does that mean I will be wasting my time if I decide to apply there?

not necessarily. You should ask whether they will sponsor visas for international students though for training contracts.

 

[MFK]

Hi Jess and welcome to the forum! It’s so exciting to have you join us and we very much look forward to working with you!

Hi!

I am currently applying for Training Contracts and wanted to confirm if I should relate my work experiences to the firm in the work experience section. I'm applying to Irwin Mitchell and they have about 1800 characters for each work experience and that is quite more than other firms. I usually would relate how my experiences helped me when answering the additional questions but since there is more space to write more should I also talk about how my work experience is relevant to the firm or simply follow the STAR format?

Kind regards,

Maryam

 

[Jessica Booker]

Hi!

I am currently applying for Training Contracts and wanted to confirm if I should relate my work experiences to the firm in the work experience section. I'm applying to Irwin Mitchell and they have about 1800 characters for each work experience and that is quite more than other firms. I usually would relate how my experiences helped me when answering the additional questions but since there is more space to write more should I also talk about how my work experience is relevant to the firm or simply follow the STAR format?

Kind regards,

Maryam

Unless the firm explicitly states you should, I wouldn’t use the STAR in this section. STAR should only be used in competency questions.

You don’t have to explicitly explain why it links to the firm either. You can pull out transferable skills or knowledge, but that isn’t necessarily always firm specific - it could be related to the career/day job.

With work experience sections you should focus on your roles/responsibilities/achievements.

you don’t have to use the word countZ the firm may provide a large word count so that people with significant experience can go into detail. For instance if you had done a paralegal job for a year, you may need much more of the word count than if you had done a week’s work experience or attended an open day.

 

[futuretraineesolicitor]

Covington and Burling LLP is listed as tier 2 on Chambers Partners but tier 4 on Legal 500. Which is correct, and does it even matter?
Second question- if we apply there, can they ask us why they're applying to a tier 4 firm and not a tier 1 if we are so fond of the practise area? @Jessica Booker

 

[Jessica Booker]

Covington and Burling LLP is listed as tier 2 on Chambers Partners but tier 4 on Legal 500. Which is correct, and does it even matter?
Second question- if we apply there, can they ask us why they're applying to a tier 4 firm and not a tier 1 if we are so fond of the practise area? @Jessica Booker

both are “correct” or “incorrect” - they will just be using different criteria to assess against (eg are you looking at worldwide or U.K. specific measures, are they looking at different ways to measure tiers such as deal size, deal revenue, profits etc) or using subjective measures which are up for debate anyway.

no firm asks whether you are applying to a specific tier of firm.

 

[futuretraineesolicitor]

Which is better for us students to go by? UK Wide rankings or worldwide?
Secondly, if I'm interested in firms which do VC work- and there are 5 of them which are in Band-1, 3 of them require A-levels that I don't have, is it still worth applying there? When I know I don't have the grades? Plus, I don't know if you remember my mitigating circumstances, they were clear but they were without proof- so if I were to add everything- should I bother applying to these firms at all?

 

[Jessica Booker]

Which is better for us students to go by? UK Wide rankings or worldwide?
Secondly, if I'm interested in firms which do VC work- and there are 5 of them which are in Band-1, 3 of them require A-levels that I don't have, is it still worth applying there? When I know I don't have the grades? Plus, I don't know if you remember my mitigating circumstances, they were clear but they were without proof- so if I were to add everything- should I bother applying to these firms at all?

generally U.K. as that is where you are working. But I wouldn’t fixate on rankings - instead you need to fixate on what that means for you as a trainee in terms of your day job.

If you don’t have mitigating circumstances, I wouldn’t apply to a firm that has a minimum requirement you can’t meet. As you have mitigating circumstances, you could apply to them.

 

[Daniel Boden]

Which is better for us students to go by? UK Wide rankings or worldwide?
Secondly, if I'm interested in firms which do VC work- and there are 5 of them which are in Band-1, 3 of them require A-levels that I don't have, is it still worth applying there? When I know I don't have the grades? Plus, I don't know if you remember my mitigating circumstances, they were clear but they were without proof- so if I were to add everything- should I bother applying to these firms at all?

Put it this way, if you don't apply you have no chance of making it through to the next stage but if you do apply then there is a chance. That's how I tend to look at these things. I'd also recommend getting in contact with the firms that interest you and asking them for their advice directly.

Like you, I can't exactly prove my mitigating circumstances with paper evidence per se but I can offer a reasonable explanation as to why my grades look a bit odd when comparing the rest of my academic results. Some firms accept this and as a result of my otherwise good grades and strong extracurriculars and work experience have invited me to interview whereas others, because they prefer academic consistency across the board, haven't but such is life.

Rejection is inevitable but as I have said many times before and will no doubt say many times in the future, you lose absolutely nothing by sending in an application