Ask A Graduate Recruiter Anything!

[Jessica Booker]

Hi Jessica, I wanted to ask you that, as an Indian student, is there anything else other than a visa that is different to the normal route that the native students take, I mean , any other potential roadblock that I may have to prepare for other than preparing for the Vac scheme and TC applications? Also, should I even worry about the Visa, I mean if I make it to the Vac scheme, then definitely visa shouldn't be a problem? @Jessica Booker

Visas are expected to become a lot easier in the UK at the end of the year. The process of obtaining one for someone like yourself will become much more straight forward, although still at some cost to the employer.

So all other things being equal, the visa should be the only process "obstacle" compared to a UK graduate. You need to find an employer willing to cover the costs of the visa though. But that is if the process changes at the end of the year as planned, if they revert back to the current visa model, it is not that straight forward as it would be near impossible to prove a "resident labour market test" currently required.

That isn't the only "obstacle" though. There will be a major question as to why you want to come to the UK and how committed you are to staying in the UK. Many international students apply for training contracts as it can be either a quicker/cheaper option to qualify, and give you a step up in a career in your home country. Law firms are not looking for these candidates unless they have a specific demand for future lawyers in that country. If you have never been to the UK, then there is a major question as to whether you will even settle into life outside of work well - if you have little to no connections to the UK, there will be a risk that even if you are right for the job, the life outside of work might not be right for you.

 

[futuretraineesolicitor]

Only the larger firms will be able to sponsor the visa right? Also, how expensive is it going to be? Secondly, "major question as to why you want to come to the UK and how committed you are to staying in the UK" will also be applicable if the visas become easier by the end of the year?

 

[Jessica Booker]

Only the larger firms will be able to sponsor the visa right? Also, how expensive is it going to be? Secondly, "major question as to why you want to come to the UK and how committed you are to staying in the UK" will also be applicable if the visas become easier by the end of the year?

The firm needs to have the licence to obtain the visa in the first place. For a large Tier 2 sponsor, the annual fee is £1,476. For a small Tier 2 sponsor, the annual licence is £536.

They then need to pay the individual visa fee. There’s various parts of this and this is dependent on some variables (eg like how long the visa is for, the status of the job). There is a skills charge of £1,000 per year of the visa, some admin fees etc. This does not include the fees the individual obtaining the visa has to pay either.

The individual visa cost for the employer could easily be over £3,000. But most firms also pay other firms or agencies to apply for the visas and the agencies fees could easily be double that too.

No - the issue around the questions of your motivation to live and work in the U.K. is completely separate to the visa matter. Basically there will be a concern as to whether you can be happy in an unknown environment with few/no connections to life outside of work.

 

[futuretraineesolicitor]

Thanks. One more question please, do firms make decisions or screen out applicants on the basis of A-levels , even when they do not have a minimum A-levels requirement. @Jessica Booker

 

[Jessica Booker]

Thanks. One more question please, do firms make decisions or screen out applicants on the basis of A-levels , even when they do not have a minimum A-levels requirement. @Jessica Booker

Some firms will have a strict rule on minimum A-level criteria and will not review any applications that do not meet their criteria (unless there are mitigating circumstances)

Some firms will look at applications more holistically - they will obviously prefer stronger grades, but will consider other information across the whole application before deciding whether to shortlist someone

 

[futuretraineesolicitor]

So, if we do not have the reqd A-levels for the firms which have set a minimum threshold, and have no mitigating circumstances, we should avoid applying there, right? Also, does a wrong choice of subjects count? I had taken Science after my good GCSE results, because Physics, Chem, Maths were being offered at a higher GCSE score in my school- and since I had peformed well I thought of subjects other than Science subjects as inferior, also, there is a prevalent culture of engineering imbibed in the Indian culture, so I kind of wanted to make my parents proud at the same time. Ended up getting Cs and Ds in the science subjects but got 91/100 in English which shows that it was only the Science subjects which I couldn't grasp at all. Will firms consider this as mitigating circumstance?

 

[Samar]

Hi @Jessica Booker ,

Just a quick one - if I interviewed somewhere before but didn't get through, when applying now, should I mention this in my cover letter that I am reapplying?

I asked the grad recruiter of the firm about this and she mentioned to make a note of what I have developed since this. Don't want to mention something that could be seen as a negative in my cover letter so not sure how to approach this.

 

[Changes]

So, if we do not have the reqd A-levels for the firms which have set a minimum threshold, and have no mitigating circumstances, we should avoid applying there, right? Also, does a wrong choice of subjects count? I had taken Science after my good GCSE results, because Physics, Chem, Maths were being offered at a higher GCSE score in my school- and since I had peformed well I thought of subjects other than Science subjects as inferior, also, there is a prevalent culture of engineering imbibed in the Indian culture, so I kind of wanted to make my parents proud at the same time. Ended up getting Cs and Ds in the science subjects but got 91/100 in English which shows that it was only the Science subjects which I couldn't grasp at all. Will firms consider this as mitigating circumstance?

I wouldn’t have thought so.

 

[Sumaiyah]

Hi Jessica,

I have been affected by extreme mitigating circumstances. My mother was ill with cancer during university and I had to miss quite a lot of study to be with her, in my final year she passed away. It affected my grades and I achieved a 2:2. Do I hold a chance of getting a TC? I started to run a company that provides legal service documentation to the start-up sector, predominantly fin-tech market to display initiative, will this help?

 

[Jessica Booker]

So, if we do not have the reqd A-levels for the firms which have set a minimum threshold, and have no mitigating circumstances, we should avoid applying there, right? Also, does a wrong choice of subjects count? I had taken Science after my good GCSE results, because Physics, Chem, Maths were being offered at a higher GCSE score in my school- and since I had peformed well I thought of subjects other than Science subjects as inferior, also, there is a prevalent culture of engineering imbibed in the Indian culture, so I kind of wanted to make my parents proud at the same time. Ended up getting Cs and Ds in the science subjects but got 91/100 in English which shows that it was only the Science subjects which I couldn't grasp at all. Will firms consider this as mitigating circumstance?

yes - I’d avoid any firm that has a minimum A-level requirement unless you have mitigating/extenuating circumstances.

the wrong choice of subject is not extenuating circumstances.

no firm I know has a minimum GCSE requirement.

 

[Jessica Booker]

Hi Jessica,

I have been affected by extreme mitigating circumstances. My mother was ill with cancer during university and I had to miss quite a lot of study to be with her, in my final year she passed away. It affected my grades and I achieved a 2:2. Do I hold a chance of getting a TC? I started to run a company that provides legal service documentation to the start-up sector, predominantly fin-tech market to display initiative, will this help?

yes the extenuating circumstances are something that would mean firms looked beyond their minimum requirements. I can’t say you have a chance as firms will look way beyond academics, but given the circumstances your academics may not be an obstacle (depends on your other academics though).

I would seek an academic reference to support the ext circs though.

the company could be looked at favourably. However, there could be a concern as to why you are seeking a TC if you are running your own business (you couldn’t get two more different career routes).

 

[R203]

Hi Jessica, as a penultimate student (2/3), would I be frowned upon my Grad Rec for applying for a direct TC instead of vacs? Would I be questioned on why I did not choose to undertake a vac scheme first?Thank you!

 

[Jessica Booker]

Hi @Jessica Booker ,

Just a quick one - if I interviewed somewhere before but didn't get through, when applying now, should I mention this in my cover letter that I am reapplying?

I asked the grad recruiter of the firm about this and she mentioned to make a note of what I have developed since this. Don't want to mention something that could be seen as a negative in my cover letter so not sure how to approach this.

always do what the GR person for the firm says - they are telling you what works best for their firm rather than the generic advice I could give you

 

[Jessica Booker]

Hi Jessica, as a penultimate student (2/3), would I be frowned upon my Grad Rec for applying for a direct TC instead of vacs? Would I be questioned on why I did not choose to undertake a vac scheme first?Thank you!

penultimate law student?

If so, it won’t be frowned upon but you could be asked at interview why you didn’t apply for a vac scheme

 

[futuretraineesolicitor]

@Jessica Booker Hi, Freshfields says that half of its trainees come from Direct TC applications and says that there is no advantage if you're applying for a vacation scheme, should we believe them?

 

[Daniel Boden]

@Jessica Booker Hi, Freshfields says that half of its trainees come from Direct TC applications and says that there is no advantage if you're applying for a vacation scheme, should we believe them?

Yes - as @Alice G will confirm

 

[Alice G]

@Jessica Booker Hi, Freshfields says that half of its trainees come from Direct TC applications and says that there is no advantage if you're applying for a vacation scheme, should we believe them?

For many firms, including Freshfields, there tends to be eligibility criteria which means you are often more suited to a vac or a direct TC app and so neither option would disadvantage you. This is why the split tends to be half and half - because they hire through both options.

 

[Jessica Booker]

@Jessica Booker Hi, Freshfields says that half of its trainees come from Direct TC applications and says that there is no advantage if you're applying for a vacation scheme, should we believe them?

Yes! They don’t make stuff up for the fun of it - it would be a lot easier for them to say they didn’t!

Some basic maths to prove the point:

seems like they only do two summer vacation schemes. At best that’s 60 vacation scheme students in each year:

so at least 25% of trainees must come from direct applicants (80-60/80)

but of the 60 vac schemers, let’s say 80% are not offered a training contract

that now leaves 35 training contracts to fill (45% of training contracts)

And of the 45 vacation schemers who are offered a TC, let’s say 80% of them accept - so 36 vac schemers.

80 - 36 = 44 training contracts to fill with direct applicants or 55%

 

[R203]

Yes! They don’t make stuff up for the fun of it - it would be a lot easier for them to say they didn’t!

Some basic maths to prove the point:

seems like they only do two summer vacation schemes. At best that’s 60 vacation scheme students in each year:

so at least 25% of trainees must come from direct applicants (80-60/80)

but of the 60 vac schemers, let’s say 80% are not offered a training contract

that now leaves 35 training contracts to fill (45% of training contracts)

And of the 45 vacation schemers who are offered a TC, let’s say 80% of them accept - so 36 vac schemers.

80 - 36 = 44 training contracts to fill with direct applicants or 55%

Thank you! Could one reapply for a TC in the same cycle if rejected from Vac Scheme AC stage? (Freshfields)

 

[Jessica Booker]

Thank you! Could one reapply for a TC in the same cycle if rejected from Vac Scheme AC stage? (Freshfields)

you should speak to Freshfields about this and take on board the feedback they give you. One candidate might not be that far off and is encouraged to reapply, another may need significant development and therefore should rush into reapplying