Ask A Graduate Recruiter Anything!

[Jessica Booker]

@Jessica Booker please can I PM you?

I am happy to respond to any messages via private message that may contain personal, sensitive or confidential information. These topics include:

• Mitigating or extenuating circumstances
• Anything relating to a job offer
• Advice relating to personal circumstances that may impact a recruitment process or your time with an employer
• Reasonable adjustments
• Concerns around misconduct, whether that is relating to you, another TCLA member, fellow employees, your employer, or an organisation you have recently applied for a job with

 

[Jessica Booker]

Hi @Jessica Booker i d like to ask for your opinion on this. Im an international student pursuing my LLM in the UK currently and I will be completing my LLM in June 2023.

I will be converting to the 2 years post graduate visa in hopes of securing a VS or TC. I do have family members staying in London so i will be staying with them during the period.

The issue is I am interested in applying for a business associate program that is 9 months long in the Middle East. It consists of academic courses explaining fundamentals of business and consulting and also work placement with a few of the well-known companies in the Middle East. This program starts in September 2023 and ends in June 2024.

After contacting previous candidates, they mentioned the 9 months program is intensed leaving not much free time to do other activities. So this will clearly put me out of the next application cycle for VS.

Furthermore even if I secure a VS in the UK or Middle East itself, i wont be able to attend it as there is only 1 week holiday for this program.

i am conflicted whether I should apply for this program because I dont want to miss out on securing a VS during the next application cycle since my end goal is to secure a TC. At the same time, this program provides valuable work experience esp in the business sector, which I feel i may be lacking in my CV.

Currently, my work experience consists of 4 internships all in a foreign country where i did my LLB (4 months at an MNC legal department, 3 months at a law firm, 2 weeks mini-pupilage and 1 month at a bank). So i was wondering whether I should still apply for this business associate program or stay in the UK and work other part time jobs until I secure a VS.

Thank you in advance, and sorry for the long explanation. Wanted to give some context to the issue.

You won't be able to have the visa and do the programme - it will need to be one or the other, unfortunately. So you will be giving up the right to work in the UK for the two years as you cannot apply for it later on either. The only other option is the High Potential Visa High Potential Individual (HPI) visa: Overview - GOV.UK (www.gov.uk), but that is limited to a very small selection of the leading international universities, and so it would be dependent on where you did your LLB.

It is really difficult to say what you should do, but ultimately if you did do the programme then VS are likely to be exceptionally difficult in the UK due to the vast majority of firms not sponsoring visas for them. Your best bet is going to be direct TCs but given the amount of work experience you have already, you are probably in a reasonable position to be considered for a direct TC. So it probably matters more which firms you are aiming for and their ratio of direct TCs to TCs converted from VS programmes.

Ultimately if you eligible for the HPI visa, then you could just delay your aim for the vacation scheme/TC by another cycle. Or you could just try to apply this year for direct TCs and see if you secure something from there. If you did, then you'd probably have enough time to do the programme and study for the SQE before a TC started.

 

[Momo]

You won't be able to have the visa and do the programme - it will need to be one or the other, unfortunately. So you will be giving up the right to work in the UK for the two years as you cannot apply for it later on either. The only other option is the High Potential Visa High Potential Individual (HPI) visa: Overview - GOV.UK (www.gov.uk), but that is limited to a very small selection of the leading international universities, and so it would be dependent on where you did your LLB.

It is really difficult to say what you should do, but ultimately if you did do the programme then VS are likely to be exceptionally difficult in the UK due to the vast majority of firms not sponsoring visas for them. Your best bet is going to be direct TCs but given the amount of work experience you have already, you are probably in a reasonable position to be considered for a direct TC. So it probably matters more which firms you are aiming for and their ratio of direct TCs to TCs converted from VS programmes.

Ultimately if you eligible for the HPI visa, then you could just delay your aim for the vacation scheme/TC by another cycle. Or you could just try to apply this year for direct TCs and see if you secure something from there. If you did, then you'd probably have enough time to do the programme and study for the SQE before a TC started.

I don't think I would qualify for the HPI visa since I did my LLB in Malaysia. I am currently doing my LLM at Cambridge but I am not sure if LLM counts for the HPI visa.

I was thinking what if I applied for the postgraduate visa first and once I get it, I leave the UK to the Middle East for 9 months to complete the program and return. Would that be possible or is it a requirement of the postgraduate visa that I must remain in the UK for two years?

Alright, I will apply for direct TCs as well within the coming months and try my luck there. Thank you for the response!

 

[Jessica Booker]

I don't think I would qualify for the HPI visa since I did my LLB in Malaysia. I am currently doing my LLM at Cambridge but I am not sure if LLM counts for the HPI visa.

I was thinking what if I applied for the postgraduate visa first and once I get it, I leave the UK to the Middle East for 9 months to complete the program and return. Would that be possible or is it a requirement of the postgraduate visa that I must remain in the UK for two years?

Alright, I will apply for direct TCs as well within the coming months and try my luck there. Thank you for the response!

It is only international universities, unfortunately.

You should check the rules around leaving the UK for such a period of time and whether that is an issue for the graduate visa (I am not sure of the rules in this respect). With other visas, there can be restrictions where the limit is 90 consecutive days.

 

[Momo]

It is only international universities, unfortunately.

You should check the rules around leaving the UK for such a period of time and whether that is an issue for the graduate visa (I am not sure of the rules in this respect). With other visas, there can be restrictions where the limit is 90 consecutive days.

Alright I ll double check on that, thanks again!

 

[HopefulFutureTrainee123]

Hi @Jessica Booker . I've been given the choice of two dates for a summer VS, and I can only make one of these two. If I state that I am only available for one of these, will I have my offer rescinded if the other date is the only one that is still available? I can probably make the other date, it would just require moving a lot of things around and cancelling some other commitments, which I'd rather not have to do. TIA

 

[Jessica Booker]

Hi @Jessica Booker . I've been given the choice of two dates for a summer VS, and I can only make one of these two. If I state that I am only available for one of these, will I have my offer rescinded if the other date is the only one that is still available? I can probably make the other date, it would just require moving a lot of things around and cancelling some other commitments, which I'd rather not have to do. TIA

No - they aren’t going to rescind your offer. There is a reason they are giving you a choice of dates. If the dates were an issue, they would only be offering you specific dates.

 

[Jessica Booker]

Hi @Jessica Booker out of curiosity, when firms do a social media background check, would they still be able to see your profiles if they are private?

I don’t think firms do any social media checks. I have never seen any anyway.

It would be pretty difficult/impossible to do given the number of platforms, that profiles don’t necessarily make you identifiable etc.

 

[handiselam]

Hi Jessica,

Are there any issues in applications which would mean an absolute rejection ?
Regardless, of the rest of the application.


Thank you in advance

 

[Jessica Booker]

Hi Jessica,

Are there any issues in applications which would mean an absolute rejection ?
Regardless, of the rest of the application.


Thank you in advance

Obvious copy and paste from another firm’s application.

Not meeting basic eligibility criteria

Excessive arrogance

Little effort put into the application

Duplicate application to the same vacancy in the same cycle.

Being over qualified (often the case with international qualified lawyers with lots of experience).

Misunderstanding the opportunity

There’s probably more, but those are the factors that come to mind right now.

 

[Helpme12345]

Hi @Jessica Booker, I was wondering if you could help me with something!

I was previously a long time user of TCLA and it helped me get offers for TCs. One of the main differences between the two I was choosing between at the time was one was offering me the GDL+SQE and one was offering just SQE with Barbri prep course. I was concerned about not doing the GDL at all and raised this quite a lot in my discussions with the law firm but ultimately I chose them because I thought they were a better fit.

Fast forward two years and I’ve just sat my SQE exams and to say I feel so let down my the Barbri course is an understatement. The questions on their mocks (where I was getting 85%) were no where near the same difficulty and while I think I managed to pass FLK1, I don’t think I will have passed FLK2. The other future trainees in my cohort found the same exam hard but said they were able to rely on some GDL knowledge so I don’t think they found it as difficultI don’t believe I could have revised more and achieved a better result with the Barbri course, but in hindsight I wish I’d looked at more forums etc as then I would have understood the differences in difficulty and prepared better.

Anyway I was wondering what your opinion was on emailing my firm before results come out? I don’t want to come across like a worrier when results aren’t even out yet nor do I want to seem like I’m playing the blame game after a bad exam, but on the other hand I think maybe saying something now will benefit my case if I find out I have failed in March? Ultimately my TC is contingent on me passing first time, but the contract does say to contact them to “discuss a way forward”.

Thanks in advance!

I just thought it was important to come back to this and say that I ended up passing in the first quintile (very relieved!). But definitely a lesson learned that pretty much everyone on my prep course found the exam equally bad and ended up doing equally well - if anyone ever feels a similar way I hope this is reassuring!! Thankfully I didn't email the firm haha

 

[Jessica Booker]

I just thought it was important to come back to this and say that I ended up passing in the first quintile (very relieved!). But definitely a lesson learned that pretty much everyone on my prep course found the exam equally bad and ended up doing equally well - if anyone ever feels a similar way I hope this is reassuring!! Thankfully I didn't email the firm haha

Glad to hear you did so well!

 

[Lastseasonwonder]

Hi @Jessica Booker,

I am finding it very difficult to secure a paralegal job in London. This is boiled down to the fact that 99% of paralegal positions in London require at least 6 months of experience (usually it is 1 year, and some state 2-3 years!). I am a recent graduate and have no paralegal experience. The usual response I am receiving is that "although your CV / academics / profile looks great, you do not match the requirements of the role / you do not have the requisite experience". What on earth do I do? It seems impossible to secure a paralegal job in London.

Therefore I wanted to ask the following:

(1) What other jobs can I do in London as an aspiring commercial lawyer (don't have a TC atm).

(2) Thinking of relocating outside of London for a paralegal role (it seems a lot easier to secure a paralegal role outside London as I don't think the requirements are as strict). I don't live in the locations I am considering, so how would such a relocation usually happen? Does the firm help with it? Or do you just have to find a place before the role starts?

Would really appreciate your help.

 

[Jessica Booker]

Hi @Jessica Booker,

I am finding it very difficult to secure a paralegal job in London. This is boiled down to the fact that 99% of paralegal positions in London require at least 6 months of experience (usually it is 1 year, and some state 2-3 years!). I am a recent graduate and have no paralegal experience. The usual response I am receiving is that "although your CV / academics / profile looks great, you do not match the requirements of the role / you do not have the requisite experience". What on earth do I do? It seems impossible to secure a paralegal job in London.

Therefore I wanted to ask the following:

(1) What other jobs can I do in London as an aspiring commercial lawyer (don't have a TC atm).

(2) Thinking of relocating outside of London for a paralegal role (it seems a lot easier to secure a paralegal role outside London as I don't think the requirements are as strict). I don't live in the locations I am considering, so how would such a relocation usually happen? Does the firm help with it? Or do you just have to find a place before the role starts?

Would really appreciate your help.

1) There is no set rule to this - you can do many different types of roles. That could be within a law firm (eg business development, compliance/conflicts) but there are a vast array of roles I have seen people work in - from the civil service, to banking. I wouldn’t focus too much on particular types of roles, more so what you want to do/will find interesting.

2) Getting any form of relocation allowance for a paralegal role is highly unlikely, and the organisation won’t necessarily have the resources to support you find accommodation, so it would have to be something you would need to arrange if your own accord. If you were offered a role, you could negotiate a start date to allow you time to find somewhere.

For paralegal roles, focus more on temp or fixed term contract roles - these tend to have less requirements for you to need experience.

 

[Lastseasonwonder]

1) There is no set rule to this - you can do many different types of roles. That could be within a law firm (eg business development, compliance/conflicts) but there are a vast array of roles I have seen people work in - from the civil service, to banking. I wouldn’t focus too much on particular types of roles, more so what you want to do/will find interesting.

2) Getting any form of relocation allowance for a paralegal role is highly unlikely, and the organisation won’t necessarily have the resources to support you find accommodation, so it would have to be something you would need to arrange if your own accord. If you were offered a role, you could negotiate a start date to allow you time to find somewhere.

For paralegal roles, focus more on temp or fixed term contract roles - these tend to have less requirements for you to need experience.

(1) I see your point here about doing what interests me, and I would be interested in a BD role within a law firm. But once a recruiter sees my legal experience on my CV, they are usually not interested in progressing my application as they instantly know that I am not interested in pursing this role for the long-term. How do you overcome that? A lot of the jobs you have mentioned want to see a commitment in the long-term and quite a lot also require experience.

(2) Thank you for clarifying.

 

[Jessica Booker]

(1) I see your point here about doing what interests me, and I would be interested in a BD role within a law firm. But once a recruiter sees my legal experience on my CV, they are usually not interested in progressing my application as they instantly know that I am not interested in pursing this role for the long-term. How do you overcome that? A lot of the jobs you have mentioned want to see a commitment in the long-term and quite a lot also require experience.

(2) Thank you for clarifying.

I would apply to temp/contract roles rather than perm roles. That typically changes the dynamic around needing someone long term.

 

[Law1099]

Hi Jessica, do you think the pass the sqe first time or your tc is reneged and you have to pay back the full loan/funding will be strictly enforced? It’s in my contract but I can’t help thinking how incredibly harsh it is to do that on such a new exam! Not only will you not have a job but being in 20k debt - it seems like a really strange thing to put in a contract.

 

[Jessica Booker]

Hi Jessica, do you think the pass the sqe first time or your tc is reneged and you have to pay back the full loan/funding will be strictly enforced? It’s in my contract but I can’t help thinking how incredibly harsh it is to do that on such a new exam! Not only will you not have a job but being in 20k debt - it seems like a really strange thing to put in a contract.

It’s legacy clauses from the LPC - these policies have been in place for decades so it isn’t anything new/that was deemed unfair before.

It’s a very normal thing to put into a contract to make sure people think about things carefully. The firm is making a £20k investment in you potentially for no return otherwise. They are also a hire short too so it’s by far ideal for them too to be in this position.

Whether the clause is enforced or not is pretty difficult to say and I think ultimately comes down to the individual firm’s approach to this. When it was the LPC, I worked for firms who did get it repaid (often paid in monthly instalments spread over 7-8 years) and others who just wrote it off. Decisions were also made on a case by case basis. Ultimately if you didn’t complete the course and had bad attendance, then I would expect the firm to say you will need to repay, while if there were certain circumstances outside of your control, then that could be deemed mitigating circumstances and some form of compromise might be reached.

My sense is that many firms will offer more of an opportunity to resit and defer the TC start date rather than just renege the offer completely. However, what does seem to differ is what firms are happy to offer with this decision - for instance some firms will not cover the cost of the resit or will reclaw the cost of it from the trainee’s salary once they start (assuming they do), or would reclaw back and resit fees if the individual was to fail again.

 

[Law1099]

It’s legacy clauses from the LPC - these policies have been in place for decades so it isn’t anything new/that was deemed unfair before.

It’s a very normal thing to put into a contract to make sure people think about things carefully. The firm is making a £20k investment in you potentially for no return otherwise. They are also a hire short too so it’s by far ideal for them too to be in this position.

Whether the clause is enforced or not is pretty difficult to say and I think ultimately comes down to the individual firm’s approach to this. When it was the LPC, I worked for firms who did get it repaid (often paid in monthly instalments spread over 7-8 years) and others who just wrote it off. Decisions were also made on a case by case basis. Ultimately if you didn’t complete the course and had bad attendance, then I would expect the firm to say you will need to repay, while if there were certain circumstances outside of your control, then that could be deemed mitigating circumstances and some form of compromise might be reached.

My sense is that many firms will offer more of an opportunity to resit and defer the TC start date rather than just renege the offer completely. However, what does seem to differ is what firms are happy to offer with this decision - for instance some firms will not cover the cost of the resit or will reclaw the cost of it from the trainee’s salary once they start (assuming they do), or would reclaw back and resit fees if the individual was to fail again.

Thanks- this makes sense. I would think if you purposely flunked the sqe the firm would be harsh. It just seemed very harsh if you had a bad day (considering the sqe 1 is made up of only 2 days of assessments) that you are thrown into a much more precarious position than if you didn’t have a tc at all.

 

[Georgethe1]

I recently completed an Access to HE Diploma, translating to 144 UCAS points.

My intention is to advance my education by enrolling in an LLB program at the University of Law, which offers a 2-year accelerated course. This option seems fitting, considering my age and situation. However, I am apprehensive that this choice may have long-term implications on my career prospects. Would it be more prudent for me to pursue a 3-year LLB program at a Russell Group university instead?

Many thanks for this.