Applying for a training contract after 3/4 years as a mature candidate

[TCinpipeline]

Hi - following the post regarding “I got a training contract after ten years”, it got me thinking of reading online (I can’t recall where, so I do not know if it is a reliable source) that law firms tend to only accept candidates that have completed the LPC within the last 3/4 years. They like candidates to have completed it recently than a while ago. Does anyone know if this is correct?

It is great to read that you can still hope to get a training contract after years of applying. The candidate clearly had a lot of determination and tenacity. Being a mature candidate myself, does anyone have knowledge of which law firms that take candidates for training contracts with life experience? It puts me off applying to firms that do not indicate or promote diversity on their careers pages of accepting candidates from a variety of backgrounds such as non-Russell group universities, age and career changers. Some only give the qualities/competencies they are looking for and no other information which leaves you thinking if it may not be the right kind of firm for me.

Thank you.

 

[HorsesForCoursesNeighNeighNeigh]

Hi! I was applying earlier this year, having graduated my BA in 2017 so might have been in a similar boat to you? But I didn't do law and hadn't started either GDL or LPC, I was working in another sector. It sounds like you've already done the LPC and been working in other jobs the last few years, is that right? Was that working in the legal sector or pursuing other things? Sorry I can't comment on any of the specifics on the LPC though.

I definitely found when I was applying that there are some places that actively target students and others that seem to be a lot more receptive to more mature candidates. Clifford Chance is definitely in the first group but I think most firms are however at least in theory interested in mature candidates too. Most people seem to be staying fairly anonymous on the career changer threads but you can tell a lot from going through LinkedIn of current/future trainees of different firms. There were a few names off the top of my head that seemed particularly keen, and when I googled law firm career changers many of them were top results too! So they're clearly doing a good job at pushing the message..

I've seen some firms on there that hire a lot from paralegals and some like Jones Day have a process that really suits mature candidates. I've heard good things about HFW, would also say Mayer Brown (personal experience and they do recruitment drives in the area), CRS (lots of career changers and recruitment from paralegals), Irwin Mitchell and Shearman do specific career changer recruitment. I think Macfarlanes have a decent number of career changers. I think Osborne Clarke's process might also be very mature applicant friendly? I remember some of the smaller US firms are known for taking a mature people but I can't think of any names immediately, but if you did some digging they'd come up. It would depend on your areas of interest and career to date, there might be sectoral experience that appeals to specific firms? Firms with really strong sectoral interests might value that a lot.

I also looked at application processes for firms as part of my consideration of whether to apply. I was a bit put off by some of the firms' applications which had questions focusing on university societies, whereas others had wider questions that let you bring in other experiences. Firms that interview earlier rather than later in the process seem easier for mature candidates too IMO as that's where experience really helps.

 

[EVjuji]

Hi! I was applying earlier this year, having graduated my BA in 2017 so might have been in a similar boat to you? But I didn't do law and hadn't started either GDL or LPC, I was working in another sector. It sounds like you've already done the LPC and been working in other jobs the last few years, is that right? Sorry I can't comment on any of the specifics on the LPC though.

I definitely found when I was applying that there are some places that actively target students and others that seem to be a lot more receptive to more mature candidates. Clifford Chance is definitely in the first group but I think most firms are however at least in theory interested in mature candidates too. Most people seem to be staying fairly anonymous on the career changer threads but you can tell a lot from going through LinkedIn of current/future trainees of different firms. There were a few names off the top of my head that seemed particularly keen, and when I googled law firm career changers many of them were top results too! So they're clearly doing a good job at pushing the message..

I've seen some firms on there that hire a lot from paralegals and some like Jones Day have a process that really suits mature candidates. I've heard good things about HFW, would also say Mayer Brown (personal experience and they do recruitment drives in the area), CRS (lots of career changers and recruitment from paralegals), Irwin Mitchell and Shearman do specific career changer recruitment. I think Macfarlanes have a decent number of career changers. I think Osborne Clarke's process might also be very mature applicant friendly? I remember some of the smaller US firms are known for taking a mature people but I can't think of any names immediately, but if you did some digging they'd come up. It would depend on your areas of interest and career to date, there might be sectoral experience that appeals to specific firms? Firms with really strong sectoral interests might value that a lot.

I also looked at application processes for firms as part of my consideration of whether to apply. I was a bit put off by some of the firms' applications which had questions focusing on university societies, whereas others had wider questions that let you bring in other experiences. Firms that interview earlier rather than later in the process seem easier for mature candidates too IMO as that's where experience really helps.

Thank you so much for this! Very insightful!!!

 

[Jessica Booker]

This is going to sound brutal, but I want to try and explain it as simply as possible.

The big question for candidates who completed the LPC more than 3-4 years ago when they apply to firms is why haven’t they secured a TC yet? The individual clearly had intentions to pursue a legal career by taking the LPC, and yet they haven’t gone on to secure a TC. It makes firms question the individual’s abilities/drive and also their suitability for a TC - for instance if they have been a paralegal for most of that time, why haven’t they been offered a TC with the firm they have worked for/why haven’t they looked at qualifying via the equivalent means test. There are exceptions to this of course and some people manage to really explain why they are ready now and show there career trajectory (without being over qualified). But it is ultimately trickier to prove you are the right candidate when you have had ample time to potentially prove to people you are ready.

I think it is different if you are a career changer. Then you are starting your journey to law at a different stage to someone who did the LPC 3-4 years ago. In many respects you are 4-5+ years “behind” that person (if you haven’t started the LPC). I think most firms highly value career changers. The one thing I would stress is that just because you don’t see them in the firm’s marketing materials doesn’t mean they are not there. I recruited significant numbers of career changers across the firms I worked for but they were always low in numbers when compared to the entire trainee cohort. The reason for that though was that career changers made up a very small percentage of the applications we received - in many cases it was probably less than 1% so they were far less likely to be represented in cohorts (although often much more likely to be successful in the recruitment process).

 

[TCinpipeline]

Thank you for your reply Jessica from a recruiter’s perspective.

I am not a paralegal (for financial commitments this would not be a viable option for me) but I have extensive experience as a legal PA at a top City law firm. The firm I work at takes on trainees with top A level grades (apart from the odd few that hasn’t for mitigating reasons). I don’t have top grades so those odds are against me. It also does not have many private client practice areas which I am interested in working in. I did an internship at a high street law firm to get an idea of how it contrasted with a City law firm. A high street law firm isn’t really for me personally. How do I mention this in applications without it coming across negative?

I have only just started embedding myself fully within the trainee solicitor recruitment process and thinking what type of firm/practice areas I want to work in. Having read quite a few experiences and spoken to a few candidates applying for training contracts, they have informed me it can take at least a year to get to grips with one step of the process then there is the saturated market we are applying into which doesn’t make the chances of securing a contract very high. I suspect these would be the main reasons why a lot of TCs are unsuccessful- is that not correct? In what ways can a candidate continue to stand out in applications if they have failed to get a TC? Is it by undertaking different work experience in the legal areas they wish to go on to practice into?

Would you recommend applying to as many firms as possible in that 3/4 year period so we are not questioned by recruitment as being in the market too long? From the trainee who got a TC after ten years, he stated sending lots of applications out is not a good idea as you lose the focus of the time and quality you would put in when only applying to a few.

Thank you.

 

[Jessica Booker]

I wouldn’t recommend applying to as many firms as possible. I would only apply to firms you are truly interested in. So if that is firms with a strong private client base, that ultimately limits you anyway.

Why are paralegal roles not financially viable? Is this because you would have to take a pay cut from your PA work? Could you try and take on more paralegal type responsibilities within your PA role or seek internal opportunities to move?

 

[James Carrabino]

Hi - following the post regarding “I got a training contract after ten years”, it got me thinking of reading online (I can’t recall where, so I do not know if it is a reliable source) that law firms tend to only accept candidates that have completed the LPC within the last 3/4 years. They like candidates to have completed it recently than a while ago. Does anyone know if this is correct?

It is great to read that you can still hope to get a training contract after years of applying. The candidate clearly had a lot of determination and tenacity. Being a mature candidate myself, does anyone have knowledge of which law firms that take candidates for training contracts with life experience? It puts me off applying to firms that do not indicate or promote diversity on their careers pages of accepting candidates from a variety of backgrounds such as non-Russell group universities, age and career changers. Some only give the qualities/competencies they are looking for and no other information which leaves you thinking if it may not be the right kind of firm for me.

Thank you.

Hi @TCinpipeline, you have received some great advice already but I wanted to add that I personally know over five future trainees in their 30s and 40s! This is simply anecdotal but these people are all heading to elite US firms with small intakes in London and so it is possible that these firms look for people with more life experience who will settle into the work environment more quickly.

Also, I know someone who completed her LPC in 2015 - 2016 and got her TC offer a few months ago. Her advice for people in the same boat is that it is definitely possible but prepare for questions on why you have not yet got a training contract. As long as you prepare well for such a question by offering your authentic motivations for why you are pursuing a TC at this point in your life, then I think that your experiences can be a plus as they will be interesting and unique

 

[TCinpipeline]

I wouldn’t recommend applying to as many firms as possible. I would only apply to firms you are truly interested in. So if that is firms with a strong private client base, that ultimately limits you anyway.

Why are paralegal roles not financially viable? Is this because you would have to take a pay cut from your PA work? Could you try and take on more paralegal type responsibilities within your PA role or seek internal opportunities to move?

Yes I would have to take a big pay cut and I will not be able to pay my mortgage/bills on a paralegal salary. I am currently taking on more paralegal type responsibilities internally to widen my legal work experience. I am not looking to move internally as I am not interested in practising as a solicitor in most of the departments at my firm. However, If they started to offer training contracts to qualify into the few I am interested in, I would make a move to do so. I heard on a webinar that some law firms like Kennedys are looking to offer candidates to qualify into the one practice area. Is this something more law firms will start to do do you think?

 

[TCinpipeline]

Hi @TCinpipeline, you have received some great advice already but I wanted to add that I personally know over five future trainees in their 30s and 40s! This is simply anecdotal but these people are all heading to elite US firms with small intakes in London and so it is possible that these firms look for people with more life experience who will settle into the work environment more quickly.

Also, I know someone who completed her LPC in 2015 - 2016 and got her TC offer a few months ago. Her advice for people in the same boat is that it is definitely possible but prepare for questions on why you have not yet got a training contract. As long as you prepare well for such a question by offering your authentic motivations for why you are pursuing a TC at this point in your life, then I think that your experiences can be a plus as they will be interesting and unique

thank you for you reply. Do you mind me asking which US law firms they accepted TCs from please?

It is a fair question for firms to ask but they must be prepared with the response that they haven't been successful from previous attempts in applying 😥but then of course we can expand on why at this point we feel are are prepared and ready, etc.....

 

[James Carrabino]

thank you for you reply. Do you mind me asking which US law firms they accepted TCs from please?

It is a fair question for firms to ask but they must be prepared with the response that they haven't been successful from previous attempts in applying 😥but then of course we can expand on why at this point we feel are are prepared and ready, etc.....

Really a range - Skadden, Latham, BCLP, Mayer Brown come to mind but I would say that most would be equally open to it

 

[Tcapplicant]

Sorry to jump on this thread but how do you go about answering 'why dont you have a TC'? I finished my LPC in 2019 and have been working as a paralegal ever since (year in private practice and year in-house). Truthfully its a combination of waiting for a particular firm, countless rejections and slight imposter syndrome. How do you frame it so you seem employable? Dont want to seem like I have been on the shelf!