Thoughts about the BPP controversy?

[JohanGRK]

Been seeing a bunch of articles on it this week. Was wondering if any users on the site can confirm or deny these claims from personal experience?

e.g.
https://www.rollonfriday.com/news-c...und-bpps-deeply-unsatisfactory-virus-response
https://www.lawgazette.co.uk/news/l...fter-severe-lockdown-failures/5105077.article

 

[JohanGRK]

Just wanted to bump this thread with two things (if that's okay)

Firstly, a couple of students got in touch with me through private messages on this forum to confirm some of the issues in the complaint. I wanted to thank them for confirming some of my fears. It's a shame that the closeness of the profession has made them uncomfortable in sharing their concerns under their real name.

The second point is that another group of BPP students (this time on the GDL) have raised similar issues - again relating to hard copies and the chaotic virtual learning environment. https://www.rollonfriday.com/news-content/bpp-students-complain-online-learning-causes-them-anxiety

Again, any experiences - positive or negative - would be appreciated!

 

[TheWatchmen]

Just wanted to bump this thread with two things (if that's okay)

Firstly, a couple of students got in touch with me through private messages on this forum to confirm some of the issues in the complaint. I wanted to thank them for confirming some of my fears. It's a shame that the closeness of the profession has made them uncomfortable in sharing their concerns under their real name. I am in the process of starting the Online LPC so I've kinda lost hope that things will improve.

The second point is that another group of BPP students (this time on the GDL) have raised similar issues - again relating to hard copies and the chaotic virtual learning environment. https://www.rollonfriday.com/news-content/bpp-students-complain-online-learning-causes-them-anxiety

Again, any experiences - positive or negative - would be appreciated!

Random one and off topic but are you the same JohanGRK who got banned from The Student Room? I used to enjoy your posts. What did you get banned for?

 

[JohanGRK]

Random one and off topic but are you the same JohanGRK who got banned from The Student Room? I used to enjoy your posts. What did you get banned for?

Ha! I am. I got banned about a year ago because of the way that forum deals with its cautions/warnings - they take months to disappear and build up over time. I think that I got banned after a bunch of heated posts in response to some troll all got warned on the same day. TheStudentRoom's system favours trolls over older users, because the latter's previous offences never leave their record, making a ban very likely over time (whereas the troll can simply abandon their account and start anew).

The mass reporting of a user's posts in the hope that one or two of them breach a forum rule is another common way to shut down an argument.

(and I do appreciate you liking my posts, they weren't always a pleasure to type out!)

 

[Jessica Booker]

(and I do appreciate you liking my posts, they weren't always a pleasure to type out!)

completely agree with the last part - I now wish I had left much earlier than I did.

 

[whisperingrock]

Been seeing a bunch of articles on it this week. Was wondering if any users on the site can confirm or deny these claims from personal experience?

e.g.
https://www.rollonfriday.com/news-c...und-bpps-deeply-unsatisfactory-virus-response
https://www.lawgazette.co.uk/news/l...fter-severe-lockdown-failures/5105077.article

I started the LPC at BPP Holborn in January and just finished my last exam a few days ago. I did it self-funded, which in hindsight was a mistake, and I should have just waited until I had a TC because the experience was awful.

My classes were massive from the moment lockdown started, and the tutors had no idea what was going on or how to teach online. We never got straight answers to anything, especially when it came to whehther we would be getting hard copy materials, and thats if we got a response at all. Learning support basically disappeared and so many people in my group were telling me about how their support arrangements didn't get applied to the exams they sat.

This doesn't even include issues with the exams themselves. The civil lit exam crashed and locked me out for 20 minutes, but then EVERYONE had 40 minutes added to make up for it, not just those who had a technical issue. There were formatting issues with the business law exam, where the table was offset in a way that affected what the final answer was, but they never told us if this was taken into account with the grading or how many students it affected.

I could seriously go on and on about this, but its despicable that BPP seems to have gotten away with it and are ripping off the next set of students as well. What did our fees even pay for?

 

[Asmee DC]

Just wanted to bump this thread with two things (if that's okay)

Firstly, a couple of students got in touch with me through private messages on this forum to confirm some of the issues in the complaint. I wanted to thank them for confirming some of my fears. It's a shame that the closeness of the profession has made them uncomfortable in sharing their concerns under their real name.

The second point is that another group of BPP students (this time on the GDL) have raised similar issues - again relating to hard copies and the chaotic virtual learning environment. https://www.rollonfriday.com/news-content/bpp-students-complain-online-learning-causes-them-anxiety

Again, any experiences - positive or negative - would be appreciated!

I can't comment on the experience with BPP during the last academic year but I just started the LPC with them for this year, and so far, my experience (alongside numerous other students) has been extremely horrendous. I can PM you some of the issues we have dealt with if you would like, but it's been incredibly stressful and frustrating have to deal with them (even though it's the start of the academic year).

 

[whisperingrock]

I can't comment on the experience with BPP during the last academic year but I just started the LPC with them for this year, and so far, my experience (alongside numerous other students) has been extremely horrendous. I can PM you some of the issues we have dealt with if you would like, but it's been incredibly stressful and frustrating have to deal with them (even though it's the start of the academic year).

I'd appreciate a PM too if you do want to talk about it. I might have tips that could be useful in dealing with the administration that my group learned over time. I'm really upset for you and everyone else that has only just started with BPP. At least I'm free of it now.

The formal complaint all the papers wrote about a few weeks back is supposed to get a response soon, but given everything that has happened BPP will probably try to brush that off too.

 

[Asmee DC]

I'd appreciate a PM too if you do want to talk about it. I might have tips that could be useful in dealing with the administration that my group learned over time. I'm really upset for you and everyone else that has only just started with BPP. At least I'm free of it now.

The formal complaint all the papers wrote about a few weeks back is supposed to get a response soon, but given everything that has happened BPP will probably try to brush that off too.

I messaged you!

 

[Jane Smith]

PDGL first week was a bit chaotic - some workshops could not split into the planned very small groups due to lack of bandwidth, not that that really matters. Materials for week 1 had to be emailed as pdfs which actually made it easier to print them off rather than your having to hunt for them on the system. Occasional email had wrong date in it. Some emails sent many times to everyone where were supposed to be for one BPP centre only so people got them 4 times not once (although that is better than not at all!).

This is now week 2 so the proper start of the timetable so we shall see if it settles down and gets easier. If there is nothing provided in hard copy and possibly just workshops not lectures (the latter may not be true) then being told if there is a crammer book to buy would be helpful so there is at least something printed off for those who find reading everything on line hard.

Would be helpful to be told well in advance the plans for the final early-mid December 2020 final exams in contract, tort and company law etc (exams half way through the course now) would be good eg some students may need to go home to get better bandwidth or a desk which they may not have where they are in a cramped student house. They might want to buy train tickets early so they are cheaper or make arrangements with parents now for however the December exams will be sat.

Knowing exactly what can be taken into the presumably virtual exams in December 2020 would be very useful too so people can study accordingly - not sure if that is clear yet but it might be.

 

[Mia97]

Has anyone received their hard copy textbooks yet from BPP?

 

[Alice G]

Has anyone received their hard copy textbooks yet from BPP?

Do you mean for the PGDL or the LPC?

I don't think PGDL students have hard copy textbooks this year, I believe it is all online.

 

[JohanGRK]

I started the LPC at BPP Holborn in January and just finished my last exam a few days ago. I did it self-funded, which in hindsight was a mistake, and I should have just waited until I had a TC because the experience was awful.

My classes were massive from the moment lockdown started, and the tutors had no idea what was going on or how to teach online. We never got straight answers to anything, especially when it came to whehther we would be getting hard copy materials, and thats if we got a response at all. Learning support basically disappeared and so many people in my group were telling me about how their support arrangements didn't get applied to the exams they sat.

This doesn't even include issues with the exams themselves. The civil lit exam crashed and locked me out for 20 minutes, but then EVERYONE had 40 minutes added to make up for it, not just those who had a technical issue. There were formatting issues with the business law exam, where the table was offset in a way that affected what the final answer was, but they never told us if this was taken into account with the grading or how many students it affected.

I could seriously go on and on about this, but its despicable that BPP seems to have gotten away with it and are ripping off the next set of students as well. What did our fees even pay for?

Thank you for your reply! Your experience seems to be on all fours with the first complaint. I do hope that Learning Support get their sh*t together given how the students they're responsible for are sometimes the most vulnerable to disruption etc.

I can't comment on the experience with BPP during the last academic year but I just started the LPC with them for this year, and so far, my experience (alongside numerous other students) has been extremely horrendous. I can PM you some of the issues we have dealt with if you would like, but it's been incredibly stressful and frustrating have to deal with them (even though it's the start of the academic year).

Oh no! That's worrying for me personally... Would you be comfortable even sharing an outline or summary of the issues with us? I do understand that you probably don't want to do anything that may jeopardise your relationship with BPP or your firm.

PDGL first week was a bit chaotic - some workshops could not split into the planned very small groups due to lack of bandwidth, not that that really matters. Materials for week 1 had to be emailed as pdfs which actually made it easier to print them off rather than your having to hunt for them on the system. Occasional email had wrong date in it. Some emails sent many times to everyone where were supposed to be for one BPP centre only so people got them 4 times not once (although that is better than not at all!).

This is now week 2 so the proper start of the timetable so we shall see if it settles down and gets easier. If there is nothing provided in hard copy and possibly just workshops not lectures (the latter may not be true) then being told if there is a crammer book to buy would be helpful so there is at least something printed off for those who find reading everything on line hard.

Would be helpful to be told well in advance the plans for the final early-mid December 2020 final exams in contract, tort and company law etc (exams half way through the course now) would be good eg some students may need to go home to get better bandwidth or a desk which they may not have where they are in a cramped student house. They might want to buy train tickets early so they are cheaper or make arrangements with parents now for however the December exams will be sat.

Knowing exactly what can be taken into the presumably virtual exams in December 2020 would be very useful too so people can study accordingly - not sure if that is clear yet but it might be.

The admin issues seem to be textbook (ha ha) BPP. Thank you for your post

 

[Mia97]

Do you mean for the PGDL or the LPC?

I don't think PGDL students have hard copy textbooks this year, I believe it is all online.

LPC they promised them two weeks ago. But I am still waiting *sigh*

 

[Asmee DC]

Oh no! That's worrying for me personally... Would you be comfortable even sharing an outline or summary of the issues with us? I do understand that you probably don't want to do anything that may jeopardise your relationship with BPP or your firm.

LPC they promised them two weeks ago. But I am still waiting *sigh*

I can PM you @JohanGRK if you'd like!

I also haven't gotten my books yet @Mia97 and I'm doing the LPC. My partner is doing his studies at UOL - he doesn't even begin until next week but has already received all his materials.

 

[JohanGRK]

I can PM you @JohanGRK if you'd like!

That would be great, thank you

 

[whisperingrock]

That would be great, thank you

https://www.lawgazette.co.uk/news/b...-in-wake-of-formal-complaint-/5105722.article
Here's a new one for you. Given what I know ocurred, BPP's response is total bs. It's also shocking that they will so blatantly lean on force majeure to do whatever they want. Guess now that the new term has started and it got new students enrolled BPP doesn't care.

 

[JohanGRK]

https://www.lawgazette.co.uk/news/b...-in-wake-of-formal-complaint-/5105722.article
Here's a new one for you. Given what I know ocurred, BPP's response is total bs. It's also shocking that they will so blatantly lean on force majeure to do whatever they want. Guess now that the new term has started and it got new students enrolled BPP doesn't care.

Thank you for the update.

The reliance on force majeure is what I expected. Not great from a PR standpoint though, given that it's an excuse and not a justification. I wonder if their new cohort has been alerted as to the possibility of substandard teaching, class sizes, exam hosting, etc. in advance.

I hope that anyone facing similar issues from now onwards has the courage to report this to their firm or start a new complaints procedure. I'll definitely be posting my experiences with the LPC when the time comes.

 

[Mia97]

I can PM you @JohanGRK if you'd like!

I also haven't gotten my books yet @Mia97 and I'm doing the LPC. My partner is doing his studies at UOL - he doesn't even begin until next week but has already received all his materials.

Yes my friend is at UOL has all her books too! Was ever so jealous. Wish more firms used UoL.

 

[whisperingrock]

And the nonsense continues: https://www.legalcheek.com/2020/10/...over-exam-clash-with-winter-vac-scheme-dates/

As someone who has been very limited in the vac schemes I could do because of visa restrictions, BPP making it more difficult for students to do them really riles me up. Vac schemes are so necessary to even stand a chance to get into a commercial law firm and telling students to just "do a different one" is not good enough when the issue doesn't have to exist. BPP just doesn't care enough to actually look out for student interests.

There's also a reddit post in the comments (https://www.reddit.com/r/uklaw/comments/j3ezzf/bpp_pgdl_is_beyond_awful) which details that the shit show from lockdown has basically just continued or gotten worse. I'm fairly sure BPP can't rely on force majeure to fuck over students who enroled since lockdown happened as the pandemic is very much a known factor at this point, so unless BPP outlined all the ways teaching might change and materials might not be sent, I don't see how they have a leg to stand on legally. BPP just knows that self-funding students can't afford to sue and those with TC's likely won't risk the negative attention that would happen if they "caused trouble".